Solar PV in Turkey

[sgc]

Many people have Solar Thermal systems on their Turkish homes (direct water heating) but few seem to have Photo Voltaic or Solar PV systems (sun to electricity).

I'm interested in investigating Solar PV and wonder if anyone here has any experience of installing it in Turkey and any recommended companies etc.?

It looks like Turkey are in the process of introducing a net metering system meaning that power can be sent back to the grid which could make PV quite attractive there.

Any help much appreciated - many thanks!

[nichola]

We are interested in this and Dogan did do some research a few years ago.

The price is coming down all the time and the technology is getting better and more user friendly on existing methods.

When we last asked you couldn't sell back to the grid. This could be a game changer if that's going to change.

I'd be interested in hearing about others experiences.

[JohnF]

When we last asked you couldn't sell back to the grid. This could be a game changer if that's going to change.

I think the issue I'd have with any sell back arrangement is the potential for the goal posts to be moved on a whim, especially if the funding of the panels is dependent on future revenue from the national grid/electric company.

JF

[jackstee]

ı have been quite keen on this subject for years. Especially in boats, but also in houses.
The panels, control gear etc are now relatively inexpensive but the stumbling block is still with the storage.
You need to save the electricity until you need it. (If you cant send it straight back to the grid) Today's battery's, although getting a lot better, are still not up to it. Those that are close would cost 10's of thousands of pounds to run a household.
Then you have to have an invert-er  to change the electricity back to AC. This would have to be big enough to carry the maximum  house loading. Again a very high cost.
I know , or have known a few people who just use them for lighting. ( Not worth it with today's technology ) and a couple use it to run a small DC air conditioner.
The batteries required for a small 8 meter boat would have cost me around 5000 pounds to achieve a range of 20 NM at 3 knots.
Just not worth it. ( 5 years ago)
Its an exciting field but just not worth it AT THE MOMENT.

[angieebabe]

Agree with Jackstee on this one , we got a quote a couple of years back on this and at that time it was in the excess of 40,000 lira , when you add up your sums it just was not financially justified , also batteries have a cycle life span and would need replacing after approx 5 years , again just not worth it. But saying that battery technology has come on leaps and bounds , but unfortunately so has the costs . Solar panel energy is very efficient in Summer but your efficiency is more than halved in the winter/ cloudy days .

[sgc]

Thanks Nichola, John, Jackstee and Angie for your thoughts and feedback.

Great to hear that it's something others are interested in too.

I think the technology is now at an inflection point and speaking with a number of specialists in the UK, Solar Thermal itself is on the decline because of the reducing cost of Solar PV and the increasing efficiency of solar PV in general.

In my case, I'm interested in solar PV as an alternative to Solar Thermal.

We had a Solar Thermal system installed and it became yet another story of utter incompetence and lack of proper knowledge... Among other issues, our Solar Thermal has a catastrophic overheat problem which causes too much heat to build up when the system is unused. Closed solar systems (usually under pressure) can reach overheat "Stagnation" temperatures of well over 100 degrees celsius and all of the pipework that has been used is the standard plastic piping which is clearly only rated to 95 degrees celsius. This has all sagged, drooped and many joints have failed and leak. The solar tubes themselves burst regularly causing a leak until spotted which is a disaster when we are not there. The plastic valves are not UV resistant and have all degraded and no longer function. In short, it's a mess and needs total replacement.

The correct solution for proper Solar Thermal in the scenario of a home not used 100% of the time and with fairly regular power cuts is to use what is known as a Solar Drain Back system. With this system, once the storage tanks reach heating capacity, the pumps turn off and the solar fluid drains back to a storage vessel out of the sun. This way, overheating does not occur. Only copper pipe or stainless steel pipe should be used for solar thermal systems and special brazing needs to be done to withstand the high temperatures. Very few if any of the systems installed in Fethiye (and probably more widely) are correctly installed to these specifications and this is why people have problems with solar.

The systems with natural thermosyphons and tanks on the roof that are undersized will not have so many problems but they also don't then give lots of hot water with a full house at the start and end of the season.

I can't find anyone locally or more broadly that knows what a Drain Back system is... which got me talking to specialists here in the UK. The consensus here is that manufacturers are withdrawing the various Solar Thermal products with a view to replacing with Solar PV as the costs have improved.

The efficiency of Solar PV is about 20% now whereas Solar Thermal can be around 70% (3-4 times as efficient) but then it is more costly to start with, will last a lot less time, and has all the kinds of issues which I have experienced.

Solar PV should last for 25-30 years and no water is involved meaning no leaks.

Storage is indeed the issue as jackstee has pointed out but, if thinking as a replacement for Solar Thermal, a device can be used called an "Immersion PV Switch" which funnels the solar power to the immersion heater in the tank when the rest of the house is not demanding the power generated. Naturally more surface area will be required to get the same power effect when heating the water but your water tanks effectively become your battery. With the feed in which may be a bit questionable as John mentions, this could work out - this is what I'm interested in learning more about and exploring.

Will keep investigating and report back on the feed in and if anyone else has more thoughts, feedback or information, that would be great!

Thanks all!

[JohnF]

Very few if any of the systems installed in Fethiye (and probably more widely) are correctly installed to these specifications and this is why people have problems with solar.

The systems with natural thermosyphons and tanks on the roof that are undersized will not have so many problems but they also don't then give lots of hot water with a full house at the start and end of the season.

Of two properties we owned in the Fethiye area I can honestly say that in sixteen years of use we only had one issue at one property - and that was related to the electric booster not being fitted with a thermostat.  Easily remedied fortunately. 

Also, never had much of an issue with quantity or temperature, booster was rarely used and then only in December/January.

One of the biggest problems with solar is the "I can do that even though I know feck all about it" attitude of many tradesmen in Turkey, coupled with the desire of many home owners to get the job done as cheaply as possible, which is all well and good until something goes wrong.  The same builder fitted both our solar systems and he wasn't cheap, but he was good - hence our lack of problems I reckon.

JF

[sgc]

That's excellent going John. Perhaps there is someone locally who knows what they're doing. Who was your builder for the systems?

My current system certainly wasn't cheap by any means - quite the opposite - it was a premium priced system. A little research tells you just how lacking in knowledge many of the installers are and you're right that everyone claims to be able to do everything and in reality they likely know very little about it. I've seen this trend time and time again across various industries locally.

[JohnF]

Who was your builder for the systems?

He's no longer involved in the industry, sorry.

I think you'd be surprised as to how many competent installers there are in the Fethiye area, you just haven't met them yet.

My problem now is how to find one in Spain    given how much we get charged for electricity! 

JF