Calis Beach and Fethiye Turkey Discussion Forum
Property For Sale in Calis Beach & Turkey => Buying Property in Calis Beach, Fethiye and Turkey => Topic started by: savoyboy on April 19, 2013, 10:56:48 AM
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I brought my unfinished house for £150.000 .
£95.000 and part exchanged my old villa for £55.000 with no further cost to be paid,ie tax and everything else.(as the villa was worth a bit more than £55.000)
I have asked Ozlen to make sure £150.000 is put on the Tapu.
She says that she does not think builder will accept this but she will try.
I told her for what I have read up on this I am in my rights for the price paid to be put on the
Tapu. And
I thought the Law had change to stop this tax avoidance ?
And is it because I have part exchanged my villa.
And that I only wish to do right by the Trurkish Tax law.
Pleas let me know what you think about this one.
To me looks like I'm just about to be shafted yet again by my lovely builder. >:(
I have asked to tell me why this is so unacceptable to the builder.
I wonder what the wise will make of this ?
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I hope I have posted this in the right place ?
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Please feel free to give advice or comment on this.
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No, you did not pay 150k it was part exchange, therefore I would say the Tapu office would advise what should be declared on the Tapu, ask the lawyer to contact the Tapu office to establish what they recommend. Then put this to the builder. you haven't stated how much the builder wants on the Tapu.
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IMHO I have to disagree with Loz, you paid £150,000. The value off your px villa plus cash to the value of £150,000. That is how the law would stand in the UK, however this is Turkey and as far as I know the tapu office in Fethiye will decide on the tapu value in lira which may or may not be as you want. I am sure somebody else will comment.
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I have not talked to the builder about this.
Have asked Ozlen to ask and do what the Tapu office say just now.
Thank you Loz.
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Once again I only want to to right by the Trurkish tax law.
And not let the builder turn me over on this.
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I know I did not pay 150k (only 95k and a part exchange house)
Just wanted some ideal of what would be put on Tapu.
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Should I be talking to builder on this or just
Leaving it in to Lawyer to sort out ?
Last time I paid £89k and 80 thousand
TL was put on Tapu by the builder.
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Any words of wisdom from our Leader
Would be most helpfull.
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He's away at the moment savoyboy. I know he's been on here but I don't know how much.
Bit of a pain for you this. My instinct is to say that you've paid 150 but I think seeing what the tapu office says is the best idea. Good luck.
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When we bought our new place last year - through Ozlen - we were told and I am sure it is correct that the council / tapu office set a minimum valuation that can be put on the tapu based on square meters, location etc.
This is a safety net so that people can no longer get away with putting 80,000 TL for a 80,000 GB purchase. I believe the builder pays less tax for a lower value sale so naturally he will want to go lower and although you may pay a less purchase tax at this stage you may have a capital gains problem if you sell within 5 years and your buyer insists on putting the correct purchase price on his tapu.
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As far as I am aware but I may be wrong it is the tapu office that works out the figure put on the tapu irrespective of the figure paid.
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I worked with an architect/builder and what memory serves me from his conversations with the Tapu office is:-
The Tapu office are dealing with the building of the property, the government set out each year the cost to build a property, this ranges from (for example) e,d,c,b,a. A is the unusual in as much that it is used for luxurious properties, using the very best materials etc.. not something Fethiye can boast. the cost is so much Lira per square metre, when they cost at the Tapu office they do not deal with the land the property is sited on.
This may sound strange, yet this is how it was explained to me, you could have purchased a piece of land some 10-15 years ago, now you would like to build a property, it is the cost of the property that is registered, should it fall down you still own the land. Some where in there is sense, just don't ask me.
I know the cost of a property on this forum, the owners paid £90k, the build receipt was for £16k (at the exchange rate that time) it was not my place to argue at the time. we laugh and joke that when we purchase think of a number, half it and add 10% in Turkey.
In 2004 I was sat in a bank in Fethiye, I was waiting to be seen, in the mean time the clerk was dealing with a couple of Brits who had purchase in Ovacik, they wanted to insure the building and contents, the man had purchased his villa for £120k the clerk without flinching told him that they could not insure for that amount, it was too much, she phoned someone, she looked at the Tapu, after putting the phone down she said the most they could offer was ??k, the chap had a fit!!! he turned to his wife and said "see I knew we were ripped off" now why the complaining, he was happy with his villa, he paid the price, the cost to rebuild was there and he still owned the land.
Every year the government list the build price/cost, it used to be in the LOL, Some Turkish business person or Tapu office will be able to provide you with a copy.
Everything is for sale, and only worth what someone is willing to pay.
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Thank you all the advice.
Think ill leave it with Ozlen and the Tapu office then.
Cheers
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Hi Savoyboy - Deciding whether to stick to your guns & do things strictly Legally (although it seems this is still not implemented locally!) depends whether or not you intend or, may need, to sell within the next 5 years, within this period you will be liable for CGT.
If you go with lawyer/builder/council advice on how much is declarable, just make sure you only pay your part of the tax on the amount that is actually declared!
Too many cases of people finding out, somewhere down the line, that they had been conned into paying tax on the 'Sale' price, not on the value declared on the Tapu ..... Another, very nice little earner.
To get your Tapu..... don't think you're going to have much choice given the builders behaviour so far :(
Good luck from someone who's only a bit wiser - after the event..........
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I think your right Cef,that I just get the Tapu
And move on but each time I try an do the
Right thing or I ask for what is in
The contract I just get turned over.
Think the last straw was when the builder
Told us that our house can Not be finished
By them, I told them that I gave them
£95k 2 years ago to build our house,and
The owner said we made a lot of promises
But we cannot keep them.
I told them these were not promises but a contract.
At which point I was told to finish the outside wall myself and
Get my driveway paved myself.
Which makes me wonder what good is a contract when
The builder tells you that to your face.
I have only told a small part of what the builder has or has not done
But we live in hope that we will get our Tapu
With builder turning us over another 5 times before then or maybe more.
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In the end it's only about money.
Not about trust or being given
What is in the contract or as the
Builder says promised.
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Any words of wisdom from our Leader
Would be most helpfull.
Every time you have a problem Peter you think I am the man to ask for advice. It's slightly irritating that every time you have 90 grand to spend you don't seem to want my advice quite so much. How's that for words of wisdom so far...
Take the valuation given by the solicitor and local figures. To insist on £150,000 will only increase the number of things you and Manzara Construction have to argue about, and I have a feeling you have more than you need already. If you keep the property for 5 years the whole tapu value thing becomes irrelevant.
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Point taken.
Yes I know your right and have told Ozlen that I will leave it in her and the Tapu's hands
To sort out.
Thank you.
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Back to original Topic.
I still think that a house builder should
Hand over a new house clean and fit
For purpose.
Not with builders rubbish everywhere.
Would love to show pictures if I knew how.
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I worked with an architect/builder and what memory serves me from his conversations with the Tapu office is:-
The Tapu office are dealing with the building of the property, the government set out each year the cost to build a property, this ranges from (for example) e,d,c,b,a. A is the unusual in as much that it is used for luxurious properties, using the very best materials etc.. not something Fethiye can boast. the cost is so much Lira per square metre, when they cost at the Tapu office they do not deal with the land the property is sited on.
This may sound strange, yet this is how it was explained to me, you could have purchased a piece of land some 10-15 years ago, now you would like to build a property, it is the cost of the property that is registered, should it fall down you still own the land. Some where in there is sense, just don't ask me.
I know the cost of a property on this forum, the owners paid £90k, the build receipt was for £16k (at the exchange rate that time) it was not my place to argue at the time. we laugh and joke that when we purchase think of a number, half it and add 10% in Turkey.
In 2004 I was sat in a bank in Fethiye, I was waiting to be seen, in the mean time the clerk was dealing with a couple of Brits who had purchase in Ovacik, they wanted to insure the building and contents, the man had purchased his villa for £120k the clerk without flinching told him that they could not insure for that amount, it was too much, she phoned someone, she looked at the Tapu, after putting the phone down she said the most they could offer was ??k, the chap had a fit!!! he turned to his wife and said "see I knew we were ripped off" now why the complaining, he was happy with his villa, he paid the price, the cost to rebuild was there and he still owned the land.
Every year the government list the build price/cost, it used to be in the LOL, Some Turkish business person or Tapu office will be able to provide you with a copy.
Everything is for sale, and only worth what someone is willing to pay.
Here is the council page to estimate the cost of building, the types are all there in lira per square metre, for wooden, concrete, steel luxury, stone etc. takes some working out but it is all there.
https://webportal.fethiye.bel.tr/web/guest/7
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Steel luxury, can you imagine.
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Rust bucket, or does that come under simple?
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No that's a 1979 Ford Cortina, 5000 TL.
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Don't! car prices in Turkey still bring tears to my eyes.
did you know that it is cheaper to build a house Sqm for Sqm compared to a car? imagine
(http://s19.postimg.org/5f50q9fbz/transforming_japanese_camper_mobile_home.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/5f50q9fbz/)
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A Bit of Topic,me thinks !
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But I see where your going with this,as far as possible,o I've reached the 600 club (posts that is)
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Another question re Tapu (hope this is the right place to post - please help if not). On Monday 6 June we are going to the construction company that built our villa to finally get our Tapu (at least a year since we made the final payment). Is there anything we should watch out for? :-\
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Another question re Tapu (hope this is the right place to post - please help if not). On Monday 6 June we are going to the construction company that built our villa to finally get our Tapu (at least a year since we made the final payment). Is there anything we should watch out for? :-\
"Is there anything we should watch out for?"
When their lips move!...... :-X
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That they have regıstered your vılla on the rıght plot. (Ask to see the plans wıth the plot numbers on ıt). That there ıs a cross ın the lıvıng permıssıon box.
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the reason why the builder doesnt accept the full price is because of he will have to pay lots of tax;
secondly the minimum and maximum square meter for property prices are declared by municipality every year. as far as i know you can not put the miminum price less then municipality but you can put any price you want .
if you really want to put the maximum price , just have your tapu first and than go to tapu office and ask for real estate value increase in your title deed. that should solve the problem
when they are calculating the price they look at the construction quality (cement or wood bungalow etc, than how many floors etc)
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Another aspect of having the "correct" value on your tapu is that when it increases - say from 100,000 TL to 420,000 TL (£150,000), you annual council tax is linked to that figure and will jump to 4.2x higher, and you will pay 4.2 times more every year, forever.