Calis Beach and Fethiye Turkey Discussion Forum
Calis Beach Forum => Calis Beach Questions and Information => Topic started by: Janice1971 on May 07, 2012, 16:07:15 PM
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Let the fun begin! Only one other thing to do, break the news to the parents, the stuff is going to hit the fan in large amounts! :-\
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Decision made then. Good luck x
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Good luck Janice.
Hope all goes well for you this time.
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Well put it like this, there will be NO business involved this time, just hoping for a simple, quiet, enjoyable life, no mortgage and just time with the family! (how muh trouble can we get in just doing that!? ;))
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Our house is on the market now ,in fact it is sold subject to contract and just waiting for the completion date and then we can book our one way flights.HE HE
We too are getting very very excited so we wish you all the very best for the future.
Good luck.
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Broke the news to the parents last night and to say the brown stuff has his the fan is an understatement, they have put so many negative thoughts into my head that Im a nervous wreck, mainly about my daughters, how are they going to cope, is the schooling good enough, what if my hubby cant find work, taking them to a completely alien environment, i am so confused, life here is so difficult, we both work and are so tired that we dont get to do many nice things with the kids, not that we have any spare cash to do much anyway, Im just so bored of this lifestyle that we have, what our plan was was to buy a little place in Turkey and be mortgage free and have a simple happy life, your thoughts and views would be greatly appreciated! :(
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My immediate thought is to rent your house and rent in Turkey, then nothing's broken if it doesn't work out.
I'm sure you'd have more support from family too if they think it's a trial and they will come round to the idea once they see it's all working out and the girls are fine.
as much as I love living here I like the security of having somewhere to go back to if anything changes.
A big fat crystal ball would be good if anyone has one to spare!
a lot of people say the education is better and from what I've seen while out with 3c's at schools the discipline, behavious and respect in school is far better
Good luck Janice, I know how hard it is and I didn't have children to bring, it's a huge decision.
don't just follow your heart, have every angle covered and your family will see that you've thought about all the ifs and ands.
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Yes that is an option I suppose, it would give us a bit of an income but we wouldnt have the money to play with if we dont sell the house, the trouble is we have already lived in Turkey and were forced back because of our business going down, the parents were there and saw what a nightmare we had, however 90% of our experience was lovely, I just want to do the right thing for my girls, is there a general website that lists properties to rent in Turkey?
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land of lights have some, but often out of date, Sahibinden is good, some of the big sales companies also have rentals, but most are shorter term holiday rental but should be enough to give you an idea of prices
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What will you do once you have spent the money that you may make on the house in England?You say that you do not have a lot of money to take the children out in England but there are plenty of free parks,library actvities,nice walks and you have grandparents to visit.I am a pensioner and do a lot with my grandchildren that does not cost me a lot.
You will still have to pay for gas, electricity,rental,food,medical expenses, school,clothes,food travelling,telephone.Electricity has increased by 18per cent recently and gas by 9per cent I believe,not sure on that one. Decent meat is expensive and food generally is dearer than when you were last living in Turkey. I am sorry but I find your attitude rather niave,charming but niave. Not my business to comment on your decisions but I can see why your parents are worried. I would feel the same,especially as you have young children. It is the beginning of the season and there will be work for about five months and then everything goes quiet and the jobs disappear.It is tough in England to bring up a family on a low income but Turkey is no bed of roses either and there is not welfare system when you are broke. Sorry to say these things but I have seen girls who have tried coping in Turkey really go through very difficult times.Some carry on claiming their family allowance even though they are not resident in Britain and still struggle each week. If your husbands family are comfortably off then it is different but if he is a seasonal worker I would not expect an easy time out there. Good luck if you do go though,just keep your passports up to date and go with a grasp of reality.
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Blimey, that has made me feel even more worried, the trouble is my husband is so miserable here in the UK, i feel as though i have an impossible decision to make! The problem is my house here in the UK is so small that i am getting cabin fever, we are both working nights and long days and we still dont have any money, we dont see much of each other and dont get to do much as a family, the weather is so rubbish and doing anything costs a fortune. My thinking (and i hope its not naive) is that if we didnt have a mortgage we could both work, me part-time as i have a huge family who are happy to help out with the kids. I am in such turmoil that my views are changing on a daily basis, my main worry is the girls and their schooling, i would love them to have more freedom and have a better social life!
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You sound like a lovely person and a good wife and mother. I hope that you have good luck whatever you decide to do.
I just wonder if you would find Turkey as idyllic as you think. You have lived in Turkey before and know the winters can be very wet and cold. At least you are on the housing ladder in England which many are not. Everyone is being squeezed by the economy at the moment.
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Ironically I preferred the winters in Turkey, I think that maybe I will go the renting route, and not cut all ties here, it is a massive decision and i just want to make sure that we are making the right decision for all of us!
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Janice, a view from a male member of the forum. I understand the concerns you have for your children and their future. That said the reality is as Kayakebab has said I would rent your house out and as long as the figures add up you will at least have a little income from that, but more importantly a base to return to if things do not go as planned. There are obviously issues like changing the type of mortgage you have and all the other things that need to be done to properly rent your house out but all of this will be worth while to still have that all important home/base back in the UK.
If you all settle down and life is good in Turkey you can sell up in the UK and buy in Turkey. As a middle age male the prospect of not retaining a base in the UK would frighten me to death because in these economic times it's easy to go but almost impossible to come back.
Without being dispassionate deal with the practical and not the emotional because if you do not deal with the practical you are starting out with the wrong attitude and it could all to easily end in tears and this not what you want. In most instances if you cover all of the practical things then you have taken much of the stress away and you cannot afford to start a new life in another country with more stress than you have at the moment and that is with the support of your family hear.
I really wish you all good luck in whatever you decide to do. :)
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I have watched your posts from way back with interest, here's an alternative middle aged male view:
Sell up in the UK, buy outright in Turkey, be mortgage free, be happy with less income & no stress about who is "possibly" destroying your property in the UK, kids enjoy growing up with the freedom that Turkey offers you all as a family & live happy ever after. Ok so that's in an ideal world but it could work just as well with thought, planning, love & that little slice of luck we all need from life.
Other option, sell up in the UK & rent for a year in Turkey using the investment income to square the bill then decide whether to continue renting with money in the bank or buying your waterside mansion in Calis! I can't see the housing market in the UK increasing beyond affordable in that time if you decide to return for a 2nd time.
So now you are up to plan F I think, good luck.
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Hi Supacabby, thank you so much for your input, I think that maybe selling here in the UK and putting the money in the bank for a while is a great idea, that way can can make a informed decision, I am just so worried about how my eldest daughter is going to adjust, the little one is 2 and will be happy where we are as long as she has her mum and daddy with her, I am having so much negatived stuff thrown at me by my family but all that i am really trying to do is try and please everyone! I actually dont have a problem with living in Turkey but my hubby has a huge problem with living in the UK. If there was just the two of us i wouldnt hesitate! We are living in a small terraced house and we have completely grown out of it, the trouble is nobody will give us another mortgage to move to a bigger property as I no longer work in sales due to having a family and we arent on a huge wage, hubby works full time in a low paid job and i work part-time so its a case of if we dont move to Turkey we are going to be stuck in this pokey little house that is driving us all mad! I really appreciate your input as I havent to date really had any positive support or opinions!
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Is your husband Turkish?
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I wish you all the best in whatever you decide to do - not an easy decision.
I do sometimes think that some Turkish men who make the move to England then have some kind of rose coloured glasses on when they think about living in Fethiye. I think life as family there is harder than in England and I personally find my daughter has a far better social life and schooling here in England than she ever would have had in Fethiye but that's just my view)))
At least you have various options to try.
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Don't forget you cant just come over here and get a job you need a work permit ,same as u.k. if you get caught you will have more problems ,they are paying between 9&10% interest in banks at the moment less tax ,good luck all the best . ;)
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Janice, I sympathise with your situation, trying to please your husband and provide a good life for your children. We have friends who had to return to the UK in order to work (both English) because they couldn't afford to stay without working, they already have a home here and would love to return permanently.
You really must think your finances through very carefully before making any move. From your previous post it seems you have a mortgage on your UK house, so first, if you sell it will there be enough capital left after settling the mortgage to give you a decent income from bank interest here? And will you be able to keep that capital intact in case you need to return and start buying another house? If not, then I would rent out the UK property and rent in Turkey. I'd rent in Turkey anyway rather than buying.
I don't know what kind of work your husband is qualified to do, so can't comment on his job prospects, but unemployment is also high in Turkey, and as others have said there is no social security to fall back on. As you obviously know, work in the resorts is seasonal, what will you do in the winter months?
I don't want to put a damper on your plans but with 2 young children you really do need to think it all through very carefully. I wish you the very best of luck with whatever you eventually decide.
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My husband is Turkish and because I have been married to him for 7 years I can apply for a Kimlik so that I can find some sort of work. I have about 65k equity in my house (all going well)the whole reason for the move is so that we can have a better quality of life, my husband has loads of contacts and he was working all year round when i met him so hopefully he can do that again!
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I did a lot of homework on this during my 6 months trial life in Calis last winter, as you are finding out it's not easy to get it right!
Some basic (appx) facts: £65k equity less £5k relocation/settling in expenses = £60k to invest. At 9.5% net of tax this would provide just under £6k of annual income, remember you will have no access to this money because if you "dip in" to the pot your interest will be reduced. Top this up with hubby working full time at 1000tl & yourself part time at 500tl a month (average "blue collar" wage in Fethiye area according to my research) = £1,100 per month net income. Now take your living expenses out: rent, utilities, food, travel, etc. & it should leave you in the region of £200 per month for "pocket money".
Please don't take my figures for gospel, I have tried to approximate from experience where possible & the figures may vary, particularly with regard to income as we all know Turkey is often unstable throughout the winter season.
Imho this income is far too low to support your situation without putting yourself back to where you are today, the only exception being hubby is back "home" & happy + the kids should have a better quality of life compared to disrespectful Britain as it is today which I fully understand your desire to leave behind.
Keep throwing the questions at us, I'm sure someone will provide the "right" answer for you eventually.
PS: Please feel free to correct any mistakes with my figures, I worked it out on a calculator which I think Noah produced some years ago!
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I have to confess that I am a litte uneasy about this topic but Supacabby can I respectfully suggest that, if figures are to be quoted, then it might be better to quote them all in lira.
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Went and collected a pizza last night from a take away restaurant,Turkish family owners,picked up some Efes beer from a nearby small supermarket,another Turkish family also owns this.Went for a cup of tea at a small cafe in another town today which is owned by a very hard working Turkish lady. They all are very happy with their lives in England and when I asked them if they would like to return to Turkey they all laughed and said I must be joking!One chap said he couldn;t stand the heat in the summer!Everyone finds their own place they want to be I think.
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Well thanks for that snipit of information Daffodil, most helpful! :P Supercabby, thanks for your information, its really helping me to get a grip on things, so in effect then we may be able to get by with around £800-900 a month!
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"I really appreciate your input as I havent to date really had any positive support or opinions"
"Well thanks for that snipit of information Daffodil, most helpful!"
Both of those statements seem to suggest that you do not want to hear negative comments.
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I think the estimated 9.5% net is a bit optimistic, 10% gross less 15% tax is 8.5% lowering your net income to closer to £5000 pa. also the interest rates could easily fall again and if you are dependent on it, you will have the same problem as my friends.
I must agree though that your children would have a better quality of life in Turkey.
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"Kids have a better quality of life in Turkey".
Would someone be kind enough to expand on that statement.
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quote:
Originally posted by Highlander
Both of those statements seem to suggest that you do not want to hear negative comments.
I didn't read it that way at all to be honest - Janice has one advantage over most thinking to move and that it that she has lived there already. I'm sure she knew one or two negatives from that time in her life. It is human nature to ask for comments and hope for more that push us the way we plan to go than pull us back from it.
Nobody wants to hear negative comments when planning something major but we do realise that they will come - and that we can't ignore them entirely...
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Im not completely naive about our move to Turkey, had our business not have gone down I would still have been living happily in Turkey. The lifestyle really suited me and my husband. I am just trying to do the right thing for us as a family and to be honest I am bored of my life here in the UK. I am bored of the weather, I am bored of never having any money to do anything and believe it or not I actually miss my in-laws and extended family! I am not only looking for positive comments, I take on board that life isnt perfect in Turkey, I just didnt need to hear about a Turkish family who have a business here and dont want to go back, Im just saying that, that comment didnt help me in the slightest, I am just trying to do the groundwork so that we are in a "real" position and we know what we are going to do, its facts that I need not emotion! Everyone has their ownb reasons to do stuff and believe me I am NOT taking this move lightly as I have my 2 beautiful daughters to consider!
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I apologise if I misunderstood those two statements janice.
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I have been watching this thread with interest and there has been some very good advice. Here is mine for what it is worth ...
Rent your house out in the UK and don't sell it. Rent in Turkey but do the best deal for a long term rent of a year or so. Make sure you have enough money for flights home to the UK if it doesn't work out.
Apart from get a job, get schooling for the kids and finding out where the cheapest places to buy anything that you need are a priority. Go for it if that is what you want and I wish you all the luck in the world xxx
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You are a lovely family, you made my 25th wedding anniversary cake with the bumble bee on it. I think you need to find out how much rent and possible agent fees you would get on your house and remember you will need to have someone on hand or have a contigency fund to deal with any repairs or emergencies. You and your husband sound so unhappy in the UK and if it was me I would 'go for it' on a trial period living on a budget. You have the love and sense not to put your children in jepordy. Nothing is set in stone in this life and and you can always go back if it doesn't work out. I think you will be even more miserable if you dont give it a go. I can email you a breakdown of costs living here if that helps at all. Good fortune which ever decision you make.
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A very hard decision for you. Remember when you are making your financial calculations that just over 200 lira per month will be needed for the compulsory health service as your husband is Turkish, approx 600 lira to rent plus as I understand it the schooling is not free until they are seven years of age so if you want the children to go to pre schools it has to be paid for .Turkish lady I know pays 350 lira per half year and has to purchase all the necessary books etc. No doubt Turkey is a lovely place to bring children up in but financial worries can soon turn a life sour wherever you are.I wish you luck in deciding the right answers for your future.
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Wont my husbands employer pay for his health insurance?
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Yes, your husbands employer will pay for his health insurance (which will cover the whole family).
That is...if he can find a job where his boss is willing to pay it.
I've been reading this thread from beginning and have started to write a reply several times but have deleted it every time.
Simply because I couldn't find the right words.
I understand your reasons for wanting to go back but at the same time feel that you shouldn't underestimate life here.
You have been living here before so you know what you can expect. But...apparently you had to go back since it didn't work out financially.
Why do you think it would be different this time? Life here isn't cheap, especially with children.
Many of my friends have returned to their homecountries around the time that their children had to start school.
Simply because they weren't able to afford a private education for their kids.
If you would like your children to go (a good) university, it will cost a lot of money.
Either a private school, or the expensive dershane lessons, or bribing your way into one of the better state schools.
Another issue is the so-called "better quality of life".
That is definitely possible but only if you can afford it.
Both my husband and I have a business and at the moment we are closed on Sundays. Yes, that is costing us income but we have a 2 year old and we don't want her to grow up in such a beautiful area without ever going to the beach, walk in the forests or such with both her parents. We can afford to close but reality is that a lot of the children never get to enjoy the amazing surroundings because the parents don't have time. And if they do, it is quite often without their father since he could be working night and day in tourism without a day off.
I think that in your case, my decision to come or not would be based on the chances of your husband being able to find a good job.
Does he have a profession/education/previous experiences that will allow him to work all your round for a proper wage?
I don't know whether such a thing is possible in the UK but can't your husband get a leave of work (for example 6 months).
He would then be able to come to Turkey, find a job, look for a place to rent, etc before you and your daughters come over.
You might stay separate for a while but at least you won't be making decisions that are difficult to reverse in case it doesn't work out.
Good luck with deciding what to do!
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Im hoping that it will be different this time because there is no way that we will enter into any business like we did last time! We simply ran out of money! This time we will have a set amount of money and we will have to make it work we wont have a choice. To be honest Im not bothered about what my girls do for a job in the future, I just want them to be happy, I wasnt academic but I worked my way up and became a pretty good sales person. My husband used to manage a hotel restaurant before I met him and im sure that with all the contacts that he has in Turkey he will be able to find something. I dont mind him working long hours as that is what he does now, I will make it a main priority to find myself a new set of friends and make the most of our lives, to start off with we are going to put money in the bank, try and live off the interest, put some money away for Ayse to go to a private school for a short time to get to grips with the language, then hopefully by the time that she is 7 she can go to a state school, hopefully she will pick the language up quite quickly as also she will be around her Turkish family part of the time too.
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I have refrained from making any comments on this subject but I had to reply to your last statement.To say that you are not bothered with what your girls do for a job in the future is not what I would expect from a parent. I would expect every parent to be extremely interested in their childrens futures and want the best for them.I am sure most hard working parents hope that their children have an easier life than they have had.A bit like the old days in that the father worked down the pit so it is assumedthat is where his children will work.
One of the main reasons why you want to go is that you work so hard in the UK. I suppose Turkey is heaven and you will not work as hard. These guys who work in tourism, work many more hours than an average Brit does and for a lot less. A great deal of work in Fethiye is in the tourist industry and that is seasonal. So you could have to make 12 months income in 5 months.You are also making the assumption that you will get work. Turkey has a much higher unemployment rate than the UK.
People are throwing figures around about how you can invest £65k and live off the interest.By the time you have relocated that will be down to around £60k or maybe even less. You are saying that you are going to use some of the money to pay for education so the pot is getting smaller and the interest earned getting less. There are many people who moved to Turkey and thought they could live off interest and have finished up having to return to the UK. Your capital sum is not sufficient to allow you to live off the interest because a downward move in rates will have a major impact on your income.
Some of the people quoting figures have been on here telling everyone how expensive it is to live in Turkey during the winter.
If you rent your house here remember that you will still continue to have to pay the mortgage and the repayments will be higher because it will be trested as a buy to let. Also rent will be subject to UK tax.
Sorry for being so blunt but these are the realities that you have to face.
On a general note if the quality of life is so good in Turkey why do so maany Turks want to leave and go to western Europe.
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I too have refrained from commenting mainly because many more people will have direct experience of living in Turkey than me.
But purely from an economic point of view and using supacabby's figures (which he did qualify), it seems to me that a 1.00% drop in interest rates coupled with 10.00% inflation rise in 2013 would mean that expenditure exceeded income.
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"To say that you are not bothered with what your girls do for a job in the future is not what I would expect from a parent. I would expect every parent to be extremely interested in their childrens futures and want the best for them"
This comment has made me really cross, what are you saying then that Im not a good parent? Did I actually say that I wasnt interested in what my children do, or that I wouldnt want the best for them? What I said was that neither me or my hubby are academic and therefore i wouldnt push them in a direction that they didnt want to do! Also we will both do what we have to to get by, neither my husband or myself are afraid of hard work, we will do whatever work is available to bring in what we need to. After reading your reply again I find your response quite aggressive!
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There are some good things about living in Turkey and also some bad things. You just have to balance it out. This is not paradise but then again where is? You get quality of life from what you make of it and its not really down to location.
Also you should really ask what your kids want. My father moved around a lot when I was little and every time he moved it was losing all your friends and having to find new ones and has a kid, I didnt like it. Also you should seriously consider their education, a state school in Turkey is of no comparison to a school in the UK. I have seen many many families move back to the UK just because of this. What you do now effects your kids for the rest of their lives so seriously consider what you, your husband and the children want to do.
Also does it have to be Fethiye? Your husband may get much better job prospects and benefits if he worked here in Istanbul or in Izmir. He then wouldnt have to rely on seasonal work.
Even if he doesnt have a trade, I know that big corporations here in Istanbul are screaming out for English speaking chauffeurs to drive executives around and could earn over 2000 lira per month or more and get benefits that include health insurance for the whole family etc.
IMHO I would stay and at least wait till the kids have finished their education to give them a head start in life and if you have a son, then at least he can choose on if he wants to do military service or not whereas if he was in Turkey then he wouldnt have that choice.
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I am considering my husband (who hates the UK and has lived here for nearly 4 years) my children cant play outside unsupervised as we live on a main road and we cant afford to move as we are both in very low paying jobs, my children are both girls so military service wont be an issue, I wasnt expecting to live on the interest alone, my husband will have to work full time and I will pick up whatever I can lay my hands on. OK it would be difficult to return to the UK in the future but not impossible! I have lived in Turkey for 2 years before so I know the pitfalls and that life isnt perfect, however its easier to be poor in Turkey as there are loads of outdoor activities for the kids that are free! I have spoken to several mums who have kids going to school in Turkey and they speak very highly of the education system. Im not naive enough to think that things are going to be perfect but we will work hard and make it work for us!
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Well you wont be able to work without a work permit unless you already have TC.
I have been living here 20 years now so you can understand when I say that I have seen many people leave Turkey because of this and no matter how you look at it or what other people say, the education system here is poor compared to UK especially now they are bringing in the 4+4+4 system in.
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I have been married to my Turkish hubby for 7 years so i can apply for TC
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whats 4+4+4?
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Some friends of mine have just accepted a three year contract with their company to work in Istanbul. They have put their three children in a very good school and are living very comfortably.
Their parents have moved into their home in England and rented their house out because it makes it easier to look after pets whom they want to return to.
Surely having a job to move out to would be a priority. What if you work in sales and hubby looks after the children if he cannot find a job as an option? He would probably love to spend time with his friends and family. Perhaps you could arrange employment before you make the move out.There are multi national companies in Istanbul that may want sales staff who speak English or as Starman says your husband may find work with them.
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"To be honest Im not bothered about what my girls do for a job in the future."
Those are your words and not mine.
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quote:
Originally posted by Janice1971
whats 4+4+4?
You can find details at this link http://www.abbasguclu.com.tr/egitim/18_soruda_444_nedir.html
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quote:
Originally posted by Daffodil
Some friends of mine have just accepted a three year contract with their company to work in Istanbul. They have put their three children in a very good school and are living very comfortably.
The company would be paying for one of the intl schools. You know they charge just over 25,000 USD per year......per child!
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Maybe getting a bit over the top then!Still think finding a job first is important. Maybe looking for work in Istanbul is not such a bad option though. It is only a thirty minute flight to Dalaman.
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quote:
Originally posted by Janice1971
[br What I said was that neither me or my hubby are academic and therefore i wouldnt push them in a direction that they didnt want to do!
You seem to assume that your children wouldn't want to go to university but what if they would like to?
Unless you pay for private education and/or private dershane lessons, their chance of getting into a good university is almost non existent.
Please keep in mind that you are indeed entitled to getting Turkish citizenship but that it may take as long as a year before you actually receive it. In the meantime you won't be allowed to work legally unless you get a workpermit.
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Your chances of being successful depend entirely on you both. There is no reason why you cannot have a good life here, your man is Turkish. if you have his family behind you, half the battle. As for schools, people are saying not as good as Britain - not in all cases surely, as many kids leave British schools with poor literacy skills, never mind being able to go to uni. it depends on the area in which you live, which is also something that applies in Turkey. Your kids are small enough to absorbe the change and if all does not suit them as they grow, they are still British nationals and always will be and would be eligible to return and join the education system there. Plus, you wont need to live off your interest, Turkish families survive here and so can you and they dont all have the security of a rental property in UK or a wad of cash in the bank, depending on what you do with your UK house. Life is too short but one thing to remember, lots of dummies get turned out of British schools and lots of smart kids out of Turkish schools and vice versa - you are not guaranteed success just because you live in UK.
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Of course children can go on to university i have a few friends where there children have attended main stream school in fethiye and have gone on to university
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What I said Ovacikpeedoff was that I dont care what they do as long as they are happy (you missed that bit off)! Going by my own experience I had a brilliant job in sales earning loads of money, was I happy? NO I was on antidepressants and drank myself stupid most nights as I couldnt handle the pressure, I now work with people who have MS and brain injuries, I love this job and it is far more rewarding than my previous work!!!!!!! Of course I want my kids to do well in what ever they those to do I just want them to have a childhood where they are happy and have the kind of life and freedom that I had when I was a child, as the other lady stated its not all about having loads of money, I have lost 10 people in the last year who I have cared for and having money didnt help them any, life is too short, I just wanted some friendly advice not to hear sarcastic comments!!!!!!
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Janice you just do what you and your hubby feel is right for you and your girls, weigh it all up and if you think you can make it work, go for it, worse case scenario you come back to Britain and the state will have to help you until you get on your feet again, loads of people come over here who have never lived here are not citizens and get given houses etc.
My neighbours in Turkey moved over and their granddaughter is loving her school in Turkey already speaking fluent Turkish, even if you only move to Turkey until your girls are of secondary school age you will hopefully have had a good few years of happy quality times in Turkey with lots of happy memories, at least you can say you tried it instead of wondering what if if you dont.
Wishing you lots of luck with whatever you decide, if you go for it I for one will be interested in seeing how it goes for you all once you are settled good luck :)
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Thanks Karennina, really nice comments xxx
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Hi Janice - Like a lot of others here, I have watched this thread with much interest and also started to comment and not posted as I am not sure if I can understand all of your situation as my circumstances are different, my husband isn't Turkish and we don't have small children. All I can give you is my feelings and hope that just add a small bit to your decision.
Firstly we too had a business in Fethiye (Hobbs Sausages) and we had an absolute nightmare with the red tape and money, after which Steve had a very bad road accident which required hospital treatment and didn't go well at all. We too just run out of money so ended up back in the UK. It has taken us 4 years of hard slog to recover both financialy and home wise - we only managed to buy our house last year after moving back in 2007.
All this being said - If we could work in Turkey I'd move back in a heartbeat!!! The people, the lifestyle and the wonderful setting (More so for you as you have family there) I am a salesperson too and I know EXACTLY what you mean about the stress, Steve is now working as a lorry driver and we are like ships that pass in the night! So we have the house, the 2 cars and more money than we ever had in Calis but are we happier .... No No No.
I remember many times towards the end of our new life in Calis, when the bank account was depleated and we didn't know what to do, we would just walk and talk, down the back streets not the front, passing the locals that always said Merhaba, looking at the mountains, buying some fresh bread at the local shop where the man there always smiled annd asked us how we were & saying to Steve "I know where I would rather be poor"
We hardly ever went out for dinner, the price of efes in the the bars didn't effect us so for you I would say if you want good old fashion family life, eating local produce like the rest of the family and picnics on the beach, Go for it. I don't know what your financial position is, if you have only bought your house in the past 5 years renting out is prob not an option? I would probably say don't buy again (for the first year at least) wait until you are absolutely sure that this is where you want your family to grow up. Try to live away from the tourism as much as you can and only dip into your capital in emergancies.
I understand what you are saying about your children and money isn't everything to some people, what they will learn is that family matters, the children in Turkey have far more respect for parents and teachers than a lot of kids in the UK. If your daughters were teenagers I would say don't go ( my daughter was 15 when we went there) but at your girls age the language will be no problem and they will just fit in.
As I said to start - Just my opinion - for what it's worth. Good Luck with whatever you decide :)
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It's my experience that the vast majority of kids in the UK are respectful of their parents and teachers.
Just wanted to express that opinion.
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quote:
Originally posted by Karennina
worse case scenario you come back to Britain and the state will have to help you until you get on your feet again
I don't agree with that I'm afraid.
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Hi Scareylady, many thanks for your response, I know exactly what you mean about the business, we had Ayse's Cakes in Gunlukbasi and we were completely legal and above board and the red tape was just ridiculous! And Highlander what is your problem with that? I have worked full time all my life, I have paid into the system and have never taken anything out, am I not as equally deserving as foreigners who come into the UK who havent paid a penny into the pot?
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Well, there does not seem to be much you do agree with.
I'm sure Janice has taken note of your 'negative' comments.
quote:
Originally posted by Highlander
quote:
Originally posted by Karennina
worse case scenario you come back to Britain and the state will have to help you until you get on your feet again
I don't agree with that I'm afraid.
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I am afraid Karennina was wrong when she said "worse case scenario you come back to Britain and the state will have to help you until you get on your feet again, loads of people come over here who have never lived here are not citizens and get given houses etc''
I have returned to England after living in Turkey for 3 years.I have been told that I am not able to claim housing benefit because my bank accounts show that I had a lot more than 16K in my British bank account when I left for Turkey (16K savings is the cut off point for people who want claim housing benefit and income support).I have to prove that I do not have money in a Turkish bank account,which appears to be impossible.I was asked to show evidence that I had not squandered the money, which is something I cannot do as I did spend most of it on my (ex)partner and on living expenses.
I had worked since the age of 17, and had paid tax and NI contributions. I had never claimed benefits of any kind, and brought up my child on my own, due to my hubby passing away at the age of 28, 23 years ago.
Thankfully, my family have been supportive(financially and emotionally), and are helping me to re-build my life.
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They say more people die regretting what they didn't do than did.
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Col
to the best of my knowledge this is a discussion forum and I will continue to agree or disagree with comments made by others on here.
On 08 May 2012 janice1971 posted "your thoughts and views would be greatly appreciated". Clearly that does not include views which are construed as being negative.
Whether or not janice1971 has taken note of my comments is entirely up to her.
And for the record I do not agree with "loads of people come over here who have never lived here are not citizens and get given houses etc" either.
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I am purely saying what I think and know has happened with certain people, we all have different views and opinions life would be boring if we all thought the same.
I have heard of many people who have never worked in their lifes and get given house's, money, hand outs etc, my friend's neighbour is a fine example has two children age seven and three been given a three bedroom house has moved half her family in and does not look after her children at all well has no intention at all of ever looking for work.
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Glasgow is full of the same Karennina:(
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Sorry but this is a generalisation, surely no one would willingly condone those that deliberately abuse the welfare system. In this current topic I would have thought that by suggesting that someone use the welfare system as a safety net if things do not work out in Turkey is somewhat irresponsible, regardless of someone's relitives neighbours:-\
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Believe me I wouldnt want to have to rely on the state for anything, I do have some pride, we will do everything within our power for this not to happen! I have paid a mortgage on my house for nearly 22 years (most of which when I was living alone) without any handouts from anyone, I am not irresponsible!!!!!
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Janice1971 I think you misunderstood.
I did not mean that you were irresponsible but that for it to be suggested that "someone use the welfare system as a safety net if things do not work out in Turkey is somewhat irresponsible" this was directed at the comments made by Karennina "worse case scenario you come back to Britain and the state will have to help you until you get on your feet again, loads of people come over here who have never lived here are not citizens and get given houses etc."
Hope this is clear now.
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Teetee feel totally free to direct your comments to me, I am after all the person who posted regarding the welfare state I repeat "state" of the UK.
Why should Janice and her family not follow their dreams and overall happiness in life and if things go so badly wrong come back to the UK as a family still intact and use the "state" to get them back on their feet.
Facts, my friends neighbours and I will say it again were given a three bedroom house by the "state" have moved half their family in, dont look after their children properly will not disclose details of that on an open forum, take the children to school in their pyjamas and slippers swear through the night at the children if they dont go to sleep what they will do to them, throws parties all night drink and drug fuelled, police called all the time and has never done one days hard work in her life, has plenty of money for vodka and drugs. Why should genuine people who have things go wrong in life not be helped out by "Great and I repeat "Great" Britain.
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janice9171 has not appreciated my comments on this thread and she is entitled to hold that opinion.
But it is clearly a very important decision for her to make and perhaps we should not be straying slightly off topic and leave this topic to views and comments relating to her decision.
I do however feel strongly about views being expressed so I will start another thread if that's ok.
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Highlander I dont think you appreciate the weight of this move, as stated before my husband is so depressed here, what would you do if it was your wife? I am just trying to make the right decision for all of my family, again I have lived in Turkey before and am not a complete novice, there are ways of saying things without coming across as being so blunt! I dont for one minute ever want to come back to UK once we have made this big move, however if we have tried our best and pulled out all the stops, why shouldnt I benefit from a bit of support from the state?
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I hardly see what your relatives neighbours have to do with this discussion but as you are so incensed by their behaviour why do you not try and do something about it?
We all have opinions on the workings of the state benifit system but just because some are able to "abuse" it doesn't mean that it should automatically be the answer to all.
As for the main point of this discussion, a lot of those who have commented wish Janice1971 and her family all the best with this potential move but that to increase the level of success you have to be realistic and planned, which in theory will give them as a family a far greater chance of success, which is what I beleive most would wish them.
Karennina sorry if I have enranged what is obviously a sore subject for you and your friend :)
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Janice1971
I have ready over my posts and apologise if you found them to be blunt. But you did ask for people's views and I have expressed mine. In fact I have only commented on general issues and not your situation specifically. On the issue of state benefits and I was responding to a point raised by karennina. I have already stated that I thought this was straying of topic and I started another thread so as not to detract from what is clearly a very important topic for you .
You asked what I would be if it was my wife. Well if I asked for advice on a public Forum, which I probably wouldn't have, I wouldn't discard anything negative that was said. I would thank the people for taking the time to give me their honest opinion and weigh up the pros and cons before making what I know is a monumental decision for anyone.
I hope that whatever your decide, it works out in the best possible way for everyone in your family.
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Also having read this link with interest, what is so nice read is that Janice1971 is supporting her husband and is considering coming back to Turkey where he will be happier, my daughters marriage might had survived if she and her husband had stayed in Turkey, she learnt Turkish and spoke fluent but they both had to work in the UK and it put lots of pressure on them, with the change of lifestlye for him, and in regards Janice 1971 girls, is the UK school system really that great, I worked with 16+ after they left school and the chances of finding work is very low, that's if they can read and write! - many are pushed into universary for pointless subjects only not to find work in the area they have studies for, so complete waste of time. Today in Fethiye was passing a school we saw girls skipping and holding hands, also not allowed in todays UK playgrounds!
Our grandson wants to come to Turkey in a couple of years time when he leaves school and all being well, he can, he has Turkish citizenship and if he wants to work in a restaurant or on a boat the family would rather him do that - then to hang around with his unemployed mates! He isn't academic but he isn't lazy, he already helps out in local places when he's here for the summer - he would come tomorrow if he could but its too late to pull him out of UK school now as exams are near!
Nowhere is perfect and life is what you make it, but I wish you luck in the future and hope it all works out for you all.
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Hi Tracey have sent you an email
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Soreeee the above post is meant to say Janice........An everything moment:D
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TeeTee this is my last post in this thread as it seems to be getting highjacked.
I have not said my friend's neighbours have anything to do with this topic, they don,t I was merely using them as one and I repeat one of example of what I was referring to.
And yes we have informed people in the authorities about what is going on around there, purely as there are two young children involved here and I could not live with myself if something happened to one of them and I sat back and said not one word. over and out from me and jolly good luck Janice in what ever you decide :)
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Janice1971, just wanted to say, good luck with your move....I can see the decision cannot have been an easy one but family is king and to me it is a brave decision but one I completely understand why you are making it.
Steve
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Janice (from another Janice :) you have to folllow your heart and I really do think you already know that. You know you can make it work. Wishing you all the best. xx
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There is a saying about being poor and happy. And it sounds to me like you are poor and unhappy in the UK working all hours God sends, little to show for it after everything is paid for and no quality of life with your family - i.e. your two young children in their formative years. Added to that the tenuous situation in the UK at present does not guarantee continued employment!
It seems to me that as two people who can legally work in Turkey and have an extended family that can assist with child care you stand every chance of success with this move to Turkey. No where is a bed of roses these days but how lucky you are to have this alternative option!
With the excellent English that your husband must have having lived and worked in the UK for so long he will stand an exceedingly good chance of getting a well paid job in this area. Places are crying out for English speaking staff and if he has management experience which I believe he has then there is no reason why he shouldn't get a good job.
Also as an experienced sales woman you need not restrict your self to employment in Turkey. Many jobs are online these days and can be done working from home from anywhere in the world. Skype and other VOIP's make it easy to stay in contact with the rest of the world.
I would estimate based on my experience of living here and taking account the added cost of the children you probably need about 3000TL per month and there have already been suggestions about how supplement any earnings; rental income or interest on a lump sum.
My advice for what it is worth is to follow your heart and your gut instinct. By all means take account of what the doom mongers and ney sayers have to say but be aware that it is their own fears they are projecting on to you and they do not live YOUR life.
Good luck and look forward to meeting you soon :D
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Just do it, you know you want to ;)
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Janice 1971, I would love to know what you have decided having read all of the posts in this section.
We too have put our house on the market - we are both English though and are not intending to work. We both get private pensions and hope these, together with interest earned on our savings, will be enough to live on. We should have about 700 - 800 GBP per month - not much I know but that is what we live on here in the UK (as we are mortgage free) so if it can work here, it must be able to there. It is very scary, I know. I think you should always keep about 10,000 GBP spare in a bank somewhere and never touch it. That 10,000 GBP can then be used as a year's rent on a property back in the UK if it all goes wrong. At least then you will have a roof over your head when you get back and a year's grace for you or hubby to find work back here.
However, I totally understand where you are coming from. I am SOOOO sick of the weather here, the miserable, often foul mouthed people who live in our town that it just can't compete with Turkey.
My husband and I both worked full time over here for over 30 years and it was dreadful, stressful and all that you are suffering from. Lea has had a bypass and stents later and still his arteries are closing. Life is about living not about hating every moment of it. Enjoy some quality time in Turkey and if it goes wrong, come back but do set money aside for that eventuality. At least in later life you can look back at lovely times in Turkey instead of constant miserableness of England.
We have decided we would rather be poor in Turkey than comfortably off here.
You are so right that even if you have no money, you can have lovely times in Turkey, just walking along the beach, people watching and friendly "hellos" from people you meet. Stuck here is awful - can't go out much as it is always raining. I feel my life consists of watching TV and not much else.
Your children will benefit from being in Turkey. Children and teenagers are more polite in Turkey and thus they get respect from adults. Most over 40's here hate UK children - they are rude, lazy and indifferent. A generalisation, I know, but what I suppose I mean is that the majority here are rude etc.
Anyway, do let us all know what you have decided. Some people are born pessimists but having a poor, lovely life is better than a rich miserable life.
All I can say is I hope we get a buyer here soon so that our journey can begin.
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well done Sandy lea for being brave and following your dream I wish you all the best for your new life in Turkey :)I too would love to know what Janice and her family decided to do :)