Calis Beach and Fethiye Turkey Discussion Forum
General Topics => All things that have nothing to do with Turkey => Topic started by: Marggie on September 19, 2014, 06:40:45 AM
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Extremely pleased with result. Unfortunately getting there has caused big splits between families and friends and a lot of the Yes campaigners have shown themselves in a bad light. Hope things settle down now and there is no 'fallout'.
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Yes 55% against 45%.
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Pleased for the NO campaigners.
I would hate to think of the true cost of this campaign not just in monetary value but as Marggie says there will be some rifts that will take a long time to heal.
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Andy Murray is suffering lots of abuse today after siding with the yes campaign yesterday.
Lets hope everyone moves forward together.
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Now a referendum for the English about whether we want to pay for Cameron, Millipede and cleggys promises >:(
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I think it's an insult to our intelligence that any 'celebrity' of whatever denomination (Murray, Geldorf etc) has the arrogance to think that we will be influenced by their political opinions. He should have stayed quiet.
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I think it's an insult to our intelligence that any 'celebrity' of whatever denomination (Murray, Geldorf etc) has the arrogance to think that we will be influenced by their political opinions. He should have stayed quiet.
As Andy Murray is a Scot and has business interests in his home country I think he has a perfect right to say what he thinks. Furthermore, it would not surprise me if his remarks were in answer to questions posed by the media of his views on Scottish Independence. It's the likes of Sir Sean Connery who get me riled with his views on Scottish independence, as he leads a life of luxury in some tax haven, rarely setting foot on British shores, so that he can avoid putting his hand in his well-stuffed pocket!!
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It's the likes of Sir Sean Connery who get me riled with his views on Scottish independence, as he leads a life of luxury in some tax haven, rarely setting foot on British shores, so that he can avoid putting his hand in his well-stuffed pocket!!
Well get riled at Andy Murray too then - he was not eligible to vote, he chose not to live in Scotland too. Just the same as Connery.
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It's the annoying, pumped up self importance of celebrities who think everyone hangs on to their every word. Yes, he along with everyone else is entitled to an opinion. It was his 'clever' timing using his celebrity platform that caused Murray to shoot himself in the foot because he riled so many people yet AGAIN.
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Murray probably caused a big chunk of undecided voters to jump to No after he shared his dull views. Thanks Andy! :D
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I think it's an insult to our intelligence that any 'celebrity' of whatever denomination (Murray, Geldorf etc) has the arrogance to think that we will be influenced by their political opinions. He should have stayed quiet.
To quote Michelle Mone, when debating with the actor Brian Cox "Ok Brian, so when are you going to buy (and live in) a house in Scotland?".
JF
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And only 4 of the 32 councils voted yes !!!
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I think the importance of the sentiment in the earlier comment of "Now a referendum for the English about whether we want to pay for Cameron, Millipede and cleggys promises " from Thinwhiteduke shouldn't be ignored by anybody. This whole process has opened a huge can of worms.
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I think the importance of the sentiment in the earlier comment of "Now a referendum for the English about whether we want to pay for Cameron, Millipede and cleggys promises " from Thinwhiteduke shouldn't be ignored by anybody. This whole process has opened a huge can of worms.
Some may recall That back in February I said that the issue was not the fact that the Scots were having a vote, but the fact that the other union nations, in particular the English, we're not offered the opportunity to vote, and that this was another example of the democratic deficit for the English. Well following the Scottish referendum, and in particular the promises made to extend further powers to Scotland the genie us out of the bottle, and the English are starting to wonder where their devolution is, particularly as they are being asked to not only have no devolution themselves, but to also pay for the Scots to have their devolved benefits such as no care home fees, no tuition fees etc. which is why I think the thinwhiteduke is right to ask about what Cameron, Clegg and Milliband were up to making these offers without any consultation of the English, and particularly something that was not in any of their last general election manifesto.
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Brian Cox on the television this morning saying he regretted Scotland voting no, then giving a long interview about his hometown of Dundee voting Yes. He finished off by saying he could now go home. Of course, his home is New York. Likewise Alan Cummings tweeted from N.Y to express his regrets. I think the SNP made a wrong move by getting these actors with no vote to fly in and campaign.
I also suppose us tax payers will be funding Salmond's helicopter flights around Scotland.
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It's the likes of Sir Sean Connery who get me riled with his views on Scottish independence, as he leads a life of luxury in some tax haven, rarely setting foot on British shores, so that he can avoid putting his hand in his well-stuffed pocket!!
Well get riled at Andy Murray too then - he was not eligible to vote, he chose not to live in Scotland too. Just the same as Connery.
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According to the Daily Record today, Andy Murray said he voted yes. Perhaps he was registered to vote under his Mother's address?
He certainly has received some awful abuse from English people today.
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Alex to leave as SNP leader at next party conference
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I think I might apply for FM then, no need for elections etc - couple of RTE's shoeboxes and its a done deal. I can do that... gizza job!
JF
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I don't think Nichola Sturgeon will have the gravitas of Salmond. There is not doubt he was the best leader for the SNP. When he resigned last time and John Swinney took over, it did not work and Salmond came back.
I think it is all downhill for the SNP now.
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The one thing that stands out for me during this referendum more than anything else is the people of Scotland's passion. !!
A bit over the top sometimes but the people got off their arse and got involved in their future, and what a turnout.
Well done the people of Scotland, :)
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I'm confused Jacquie, I thought you hated him with a passion?
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He's either your cup of tea or he isn't (and his visions may be ones you share or oppose) - there's little grey with Alex Salmond. But you have to accept he nearly pulled this off - scaring the life out of the main UK parties who sat back and truly believed it could never happen. He brought half a million (ish) either no voters or don't knows to his side in literally a few weeks. Darling, Brown, Milliband, Clegg, all the rest of the No 'big hitters' failed to get/hold onto that half a million, they all in part let it slip away.
You will have noticed Alex Salmond wasn't particularly ably assisted. I guess that is Jacqui's point to a degree - without Alex, it's hard to see who they have to head the party with any great effect.
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I'm confused Jacquie, I thought you hated him with a passion?
I do Lotty, but I am speaking as a bystander and quite a happy one. IMHO there is no one to take Salmond's place and I cannot see the SNP in the future ever getting the support they have received under Salmond.
When in 2000 he was replaced by Swinney it did not work, Swinney was very dull and Salmond had the charisma that Swinney lacked, which is why the SNP brought him back in 2004. I cannot see him coming back now, which is why a lot of SNP supporters are very worried.
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In 1979, with a turn out of approximately 60%, the number of people who answered YES to the devolution questions were as follows
1. For a Scottish Parliament 1,775,045
2. For tax raising powers 1,512,889
In 2014 with a turn out of 85% the number of people who voted YES was 1,617,789.
Great job Alex !
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Salmond has repeatedly throughout the campaigned that it as not about "him".
I believe that by deserting his country when it needs him, probably the most, he has demonstrated that to be un untruth
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If he leaves he can become more vocal and unmanaged by process. He quite obviously doesn't think Westminster will keep their promises - promises that possibly cost him his independence dream - so expect a loose cannon role sometime soon...
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I think his ambition, ego and his " place in history " were far more important to him
than any loyalty to his followers, they were just a means to an end.
No chance of a crown now so i'm off. Nice one Alex. :(
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I think his ambition, ego and his " place in history " were far more important to him
than any loyalty to his followers, they were just a means to an end.
No chance of a crown now so i'm off. Nice one Alex. :(
I was just about to post this . You beat me to it.... Absolutely spot on.
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In 1979, with a turn out of approximately 60%, the number of people who answered YES to the devolution questions were as follows
1. For a Scottish Parliament 1,775,045
2. For tax raising powers 1,512,889
In 2014 with a turn out of 85% the number of people who voted YES was 1,617,789.
Great job Alex !
Is your point that he managed less people to vote yes 35 years later? Because I would argue you are wrong :)
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Just to add something which I see becoming an issue with some people in the future (and incidentally, quite rightly so).. I, like so many, many other people were voting no, long before the three wise men came up bearing gifts. We produced a no vote on the basis of staying together. In my case for things to remain the same. I wasn't looking to gain anything. To be honest, when Cameron started to make promises it got me thinking about changing my vote................ I will not hold him to his promises as the campaign was for 'Better Together'.......... NOT better off than the rest..... However, there's going to be an awful lot of folks up here who don't share my view and will want what they've been promised....... And I agree with another post here that surely the rest of Britain should have got a say in it as, on the off chance these promises are kept, it will affect their pocket.
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One Minister yesterday said it was time to " level things up across the UK, and there would be winners and losers "
and cynical old me read into that comment that in order to give England the benefits enjoyed by Scotland, Scotland's
benefit's would be reduced to pay for it. Naughty me. ;)
The Minister may have been Hammond.
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Typo on my part I'm afraid should have read 1997
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No not that :)
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One Minister yesterday said it was time to " level things up across the UK, and there would be winners and losers "
and cynical old me read into that comment that in order to give England the benefits enjoyed by Scotland, Scotland's
benefit's would be reduced to pay for it. Naughty me. ;)
The Minister may have been Hammond.
Sad that he is inferring that for the UK to be level, standards of living should drop for some rather than increasing for others . Is he going to be one of the losers?.. What a cop out... He hasn't really thought that one out has he.... That could have been put another way, but it shows how out of touch these guys are with the peoples they rule over. I can't get the vision of shepherds and sheep out of my head when it comes to politicians these days.. The gap between them and us is growing at a frightening rate.
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Gordon Brown, back from his self imposed sulk, has pledged that promises made in London to
the people of Scotland will be kept.
That's the same Gordon Brown who along with Teflon Tony promised us at three earlier General
Elections that a New Labour government would give us a Referendum on leaving the EU.
Sorry Scotland. :(
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In fairness Gordon Brown has not been in a sulk, he has returned to being a very effective constituency MP (the one thing Salmond forgot to do) - he is the Westminster MP for the area my mother and brother both live in. He is a bungling, bumbling lump most of the time - I must agree with the general opinion - but he is passionate about the things he believes in (begrudgingly I admit like Salmond in that respect).
I admire him for stepping up when someone was quite obviously needed to go out and try and put the No campaign back on the rails, and seems he did a great job of it.
He doesn't need to do any of this. But as I mentioned, for all his faults he has once more stepped up to say he will do everything he can to see the Scotland he quite obviously loves get the promises made, in full and on time. He may not be able to of course but at least he's put his name to it and dozens of other MPs haven't.
I'd probably have gone for the quiet life - and for that I admire his return to the front line. Because he doesn't have to.
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Perhaps I should have said his Westminster sulk, and he certainly showed how ineffective Milliband really is.
Do I believe his promises.? Iv'e more faith in Santa Claus turning up on my doorstep with Rudolph.
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I have to say that I was not a fan of Gordon Brown when he was our P.M. but I have been totally impressed with him as he stepped up to the plate in the Scottish Referendum and really spoke with great passion and skill for the No Campaign.
I watched his latest speech yesterday and the more I listened the more I warmed to this man. He has said he is not going to take anymore positions of authority as he is now too old for that and too young to be an elder statesman. Phil and I were saying what a good First Minister of Scotland he would make.
I also agree with Scunner, Gordon has not been sulking. We have seen him on our local T.V. many times and read about him in the Scottish press doing his job in Fife as the local M.P.
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Perhaps I should have said his Westminster sulk, and he certainly showed how ineffective Milliband really is.
Do I believe his promises.? Iv'e more faith in Santa Claus turning up on my doorstep with Rudolph.
I believe his promise that he intends to do everything he can to see this through ;)
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I have just watched Milliband and Harman backtracking on BBC News, with Harman saying we can't
rush these things and looking at it later next year. Long grass.? Gordon needs to have a word with them
as some are committed to a timetable and some are not.
I once believed Blair, Brown and some of the present shadow cabinet and their promises and voted for them.
Remember Tough on crime.? Education, Education, Education.? A Referendum if we're elected.?
No mention of uncontrolled immigration,signing up to the Human Rights shambles, rampant Health and Safety.
Santa Claus Rules.
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You have to read the small print on these things! ;D
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We should have a 5 year cooling off period in which we can change our minds and kick the ####ards out. ;D ;D
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Interesting .... 55% against 45% for, now, remove the emotive vote of those under 21 -- love to know what the figure would have been!
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Alternatively, remove the neophobic vote of those over 65 ;)
JF
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Securing a minimum age to vote in the referendum of 16 rather than 18 was seen as a master stroke from Alex Salmond - with the young wild and reckless thought to be by far more likely to vote yes for an independent Scotland.
As things turned out, it is reported that with the exception of the oldest voters, the 16-18 year olds were the age group who voted the highest NO percentage.
Well done, young Scots.
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Alternatively, remove the neophobic vote of those over 65 ;)
JF
That would exclude Eck's wife.
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Alternatively, remove the neophobic vote of those over 65 ;)
JF
Nice word. I hadn't come across it before. So much better than the much abused "Luddite" label - the Luddites, of course, were right in their socio-economic predictions but later wrongly condemned as anti new technology.
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The writing was on the wall for Alex.!
http://www.swlondoner.co.uk/battersea-banksy-exposed-fake-copycat-artist-caricatures-alex-salmond/