Calis Beach and Fethiye Turkey Discussion Forum
Turkey Related Subjects => Turkey Discussion Forum (Not Calis specifically) => Topic started by: JohnF on November 12, 2015, 23:17:32 PM
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Ok, the smarter and more observant amongst you will have realised that there never was a Part Un - that's only because Part Deux sounds better.
When you think of a dangerous occupation you automatically think of medics in war zones, policemen in Mexico and those guys who put out oil rig fires - what you don't think of is a journalist working in their home country. Unless of course you're talking about Turkey as we know it now.
Tonight the Zaman office in Yenibosna were raided by the Polis, totally illegal and there wasn't a jot anyone could do about it. They didn't hold back... helicopters above, panzers outside and dozens of masked robocops smashing down doors and breaking open filing cabinets and cupboards.
You add to this the Hurriyet journalist facing twenty three years in jail for highlighting the fact that pro government judges and prosecutors were allowed to purchase property at a substantial discount (100,000tl +) in a state run property sale.
But lets not forget the other dailies Bugün and Millet who were seized last week, and the weekly magazines now publishing under pro AKP trusteeship - dozens of employees summarily dismissed.
Lets also not forget the hundreds, yes hundreds, of journalists and media personal now languishing in Silivri Prison.
I've worked in, lived in, holidayed in and overall enjoyed my time and association with Turkey over the past twenty years or so - but I've got to say, it's becoming a more unpleasant country week by week these days.
Maybe I should aspire for the Fethiye bubble viewpoint...
JF
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So why did the majority of the people just vote for more of the same?
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I wonder if anyone will bring this up at the G20 meeting in Antalya, later this week?
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So why did the majority of the people just vote for more of the same?
The question is...Did the majority vote for more of the same ??
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A lot of the population, if they cannot speak English or other foreign languages, only
get to hear any news, views or opinions from Government controlled television or
newspaper sources so their perception of what is going on around them is shaped
by the Government.
I think it's disgusting that the G20 is going ahead in the current climate but the so
called " leaders " at this G20 meeting are a shower of unprincipled, gutless photo
opportunists, so no surprise really.
It's doubly disappointing that Reg holds two aces, Syrian refugees and access to
Turkish airbases. It isn't difficult to see where Turkey is headed for the foreseeable
future. It's also worth remembering that 50% of Turks don't support Reg. !!
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So why did the majority of the people just vote for more of the same?
As it happens the majority didn't (not by much though) but you are asking that question as a foreigner, not as someone from central Anatolia who isn't used to the freedoms, both of speech and expression, you have. What Kevin said above is true - they simply believe what they are told as they have no way of gaining an alternative perspective.
We could fill pages with the reasons why the AKP managed to grab power this time round, but (in my opinion) it comes down to one basic fact - they played a better campaign game than their main rivals and had an edge with their control (by proxy) of the election process and the media. The MHP especially saw their vote collapse and at one point were in danger of falling below the 10% threshold. That, coupled with the difficult voting conditions in the south east for HDP supporters, meant it was a foregone conclusion the AKP were heading for a majority fairly early on Sunday evening.
JF
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So why did the majority of the people just vote for more of the same?
We could fill pages with the reasons why the AKP managed to grab power this time round, but (in my opinion) it comes down to one basic fact - they played a better campaign game than their main rivals and had an edge with their control (by proxy) of the election process and the media.
Erdogan engineered a rift within the Kurdish peace negotiations triggering a PKK response. He then hyped up the "strong leadership" required from the Turkish Government to put down this Kurdish opposition. This achieved two things for him. First, it promoted a wartime climate for the election in which the narrative of a strong leader providing national stability ran well. Second, it enabled him to marginalize the anti-Kurd MHP nationalists by showing AKP willing to adopt a similar nationalist stance.
Large numbers of soldiers and civilians have been, and continue to be, killed or maimed as sacrifices to Erdogan's campaign game. Dirty business current Turkish politics, isn't it?
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It's also worth remembering that 50% of Turks don't support Reg. !!
No some 10+% support an even more right wing nationalist position if the MHP, that involves some terrible acts if terrorism and violence against leftist, kurdish and anything that they decide is alien or progressive. Whilst the HDP is seen as some hope for the future with their 10% plus, amongst their numbers of supporters are many PKK supporters. Watch out for Reg doing a deal with the HDP during the next couple of years, so he gets the executive presidency and they greater autonomy for Kurdish areas. And finally the good old boys of the CHP, 24% amongst whom are many supporters of military coups, suppression of press and other freedoms when in control. All in all it does not give you much hope for the future in Turkey, whether you support Reg or not. Too much to hope for but Turkey needs true enlightenment, not what we have to date which is the Kemalist watered down excuse for an enlightenment.
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Maybe I should aspire to the Fethiye bubble viewpoint.....
JF
Steady on John there are some of us in the bubble who see the situation the same way as you, well a few of us anyway....... Well those not keeping their heads down anyway.
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Large numbers of soldiers and civilians have been, and continue to be, killed or maimed as sacrifices to Erdogan's campaign game.
And that is the most saddening aspect of this one mans lust for ultimate power in Turkey.
All in all it does not give you much hope for the future in Turkey, whether you support Reg or not.
Very, very true. I never thought I'd see such an exodus of foreigners from Istanbul as I've seen over the past nine months or so. Folks who I imagined were there for life (and I think they thought that also) are making plans to leave or have already left. Many of them have Turkish partners and they appear to be as keen to go as the foreigners although for some, leaving isn't an option due to work, family and visa issues.
One comment from a friend who lived in Cihanger (fairly close to Taksim Square) was that they work in west Africa and many of the 'Stans and don't expect to live under the same conditions when they get home. She's now relocated to France.
Steady on John there are some of us in the bubble who see the situation the same way as you, well a few of us anyway....... Well those not keeping their heads down anyway.
By making the above statement you've confirmed that you are not in the Fethiye bubble. Sorry.
JF
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I don't think a lot will change in the coastal resorts, Turkish businessmen and a lot in the AKP realise
the importance of foreign investment and foreign tourism. I think these people will have noticed the
effect events in Egypt and Tunisia are having on their economies. I think any changes to ex pats
lives would maybe concern alcohol and dress code and a drop in tourist numbers would result in
less tourism based businesses, so less choice for the ex pats. So stock up with booze and be prepared
to wear a onesie on the beach.
I'll probably leave my Mankini's in the UK. 8)
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I actually think it's already been affecting us here.
AK areas get the bulk of the money in their areas, look at all the plans for Seydikemer, and how many unfinished projects in our little bubble.
Some touristic areas near Izmir who voted CHP now have their beaches controlled apparently by religious based groups.
Who's to say we won't be punished for being a CHP area.
When was the last time anyone saw a mozzie truck round here?
The number of flies is just awful this year and whilst staying in Yaniklar we overheard a few people saying they wouldn't come back to Turkey because of all the flies.
Small thing in the grand scheme of things, but it all has an impact.
Next year they'll be moaning about another poor season.
They're not interested in small fry like us, they want the big money and the non drinkers who won't taint their beliefs and i think we will see more all inclusives and Muslim hotels.
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Spot on KK.
Some touristic areas near Izmir who voted CHP now have their beaches controlled apparently by religious based groups.
Who's to say we won't be punished for being a CHP area.
It's not just beaches that have been handed over to the Diyanet (Department of Religious Affairs, or some other pious title) but in some cases whole areas within towns.
Next year they'll be moaning about another poor season.
They're not interested in small fry like us, they want the big money and the non drinkers who won't taint their beliefs and i think we will see more all inclusives and Muslim hotels.
Don't think I've ever heard anyone say "we've had a great season!"
The Halal hotels are on the rise and you're right, thats the direction Turkey looks to be on in respect of the tourist dollar. Over the past few years the biggest increases in tourism numbers has been from places like Iraq, Saudi etc. Ok, the actual numbers don't compare with those from the UK, Russia and Scandinavia yet (I discount Germany for obvious reasons) but if this current government carries on down the road it's going, that gap will decrease.
JF