Calis Beach and Fethiye Turkey Discussion Forum
General Topics => All things that have nothing to do with Turkey => Topic started by: GordonA on March 08, 2015, 13:27:38 PM
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(http://s11.postimg.org/fcuqxt69b/Untitled.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/fcuqxt69b/)
The BITCH that was thatcher knew all about the disgusting depravities of this grotesque animal, including his insatiable appetite for raping young men & boys, yet she still proceeded with awarding this filthy, perverted beast with a knighthood, even after being strongly advised against it , as quote; " it would jeopardise the integrity of the Honours System, " unquote. What integrity, where is the " honour " in any system which awards paedophile, high profile sexually corrupt monsters such as this with a knighthood ?
Then, after finally shaking off this mortal coil, the BITCH was " awarded " for her services to the country with a " Ceremonial " funeral !! Beggars belief really.
And just today, the homes of 4 high profile " stalwarts " of the British establishment, including one of the highest ranking Military leaders of this once great nation, have been simultaneously raided by what should be described as " The Paedophile Police ". The BITCH Thatcher is the one who should lose the title of " lady ", as she certainly did not display the decorum which goes hand in hand with such a title!!
Yet, there will still remain those pathetic, blinded souls who will forever bleat on about all she did for the Tory Party, ( oops sorry, country), stand up & be recognised now, I dare you, & show yourselves as supporters of a woman who turned her back on these paedophiles!!
Full story:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2984529/Cabinet-office-child-abuse-cover-MoS-beats-attempt-No10-gag-VIP-file-shows-Thatcher-knew-paedophile-MP-Cyril-Smith.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2984529/Cabinet-office-child-abuse-cover-MoS-beats-attempt-No10-gag-VIP-file-shows-Thatcher-knew-paedophile-MP-Cyril-Smith.html)
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Good Ol' Maggie !
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I think it was Matthew Parris, a Tory MP in the Thatcher era and supporter of gay rights, who said that Thatcher was totally uninterested in what people did in the bedroom. He surely couldn't have meant this?
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And according to John Mann MP there is a lot more to come out.
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I take it you are not a conservative voter Gordon?
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And according to John Mann MP there is a lot more to come out.
I thought that was what the bishop said to the actress ?
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Well said Gordon. My sentiments exactly.
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I take it you are not a conservative voter Gordon?
Now, whatever gives you that idea, snowtop ??
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That truly upsets me to find this out. I certainly don't want any debate but I had great admiration for Margaret Thatcher for a lot of things she stood up for - how truly, truly awful that she didn't stand up for the abused children we now find out she was told about. That has really upset me.
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A few years ago Sir Bernard Ingham, Thatchers press secretary was being interviewed about
some scandal that had made the news and the person next to him, obviously not a fan said
" and we all know about you, you dirty old sod ". Ingham, a bully and never lost for words never
said a word and turned a brighter shade of red than he normally was. His silence stunned me
and I sensed that he was guilty of something bad. Who knows what will come out now but
EVERYTHING should be made public .The people telling us how to live our lives should now
reveal how they have been living theirs.!!
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A few years ago Sir Bernard Ingham, Thatchers press secretary was being interviewed about
some scandal that had made the news and the person next to him, obviously not a fan said
" and we all know about you, you dirty old sod ". Ingham, a bully and never lost for words never
said a word and turned a brighter shade of red than he normally was. His silence stunned me
and I sensed that he was guilty of something bad. Who knows what will come out now but
EVERYTHING should be made public .The people telling us how to live our lives should now
reveal how they have been living theirs.!!
Kevin, NO blame will be laid at the feet of ( THE BITCH ) thatcher, unless we, the electorate, use the only in-alienable right that we have , and that is the ballot box, to rid our once great nation of the " Old Boys " club which has gone far beyond legal excuses in order to protect it's own , whether they be sexually perverted deviants, expenses THIEVES, (not cheats ) !! It is not too late for us, the REAL Britons to get up on our back legs, & tell this bunch of over-privileged, useless self-centred buffoons, that we have had enough, & will not take any more !!
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Sadly :( come the elections there will be many voters behaving like turkeys voting for a holiday at christmas :( . Nothing will ever convince them that Thatcher was a curse on the UK and it's people, they blindly follow the likes of the Mail, Express or Telegraph etc.. Perhaps there should be some sort of test before you can vote, anybody stupid enough to think of voting Tory. should be automatically disqualified.
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But it isn't just Tories that are implicated in this child abuse scandal, it's other politicians and members of the " establishment ".
The whole system stinks and the kids in this country have for years been let down by a whole series of "professional " b###ards.
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Gordon, tell us who we should be voting for at the next Election, because I cannot differentiate between any of the current political parties.
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I think Michael Sheen sums it up best in this extract of his speech made on March 1st this year....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=XLMYgb7xs38
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Totally agree with Jacqui. I was brought up in a family of coalminers. We were all labour through and through. Grandad even carried the pit banner on the Jarrow March.
Voted Labour all my life until that little toady Blair came along with his pension-robbing sidekick Brown. My company's final salary pension was decimated. My financial advisor told me that my pension would be worth 30% more if not for Brown's raid on pension funds. So much for them being the "party of the working man"
So what's the alternative? Don't know really. Is there one? Don't trust Cameron, trust Milliband even less and Clegg even less than that. The Greens are just a pathetic joke. Still can't make my mind up about UKIP; Farage seems to make the right noises but something about the man I just don't trust.
Coming up to General Election it appears to be "tell them what they want to hear time" I would love some investigative journalist to do an article on promises made before the elections and what they actually did when when they got into power.
I voted Conservative just once - on the promise they made to right the wrongs of the Equitable Life fiasco. Did they keep that promise? NO.
Mind, in my home constituency I seem to have 2 main choices. Jonathan Djanogly (Con) who seems to think that having a duckpond built at his home is a legitimate parliamentary expense and Lord Toby Jugg of the Eccentric Party (formally Monster Raving Loony Party).
On reflection I think my choice maybe my choice has just got easier!!
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Gordon, tell us who we should be voting for at the next Election, because I cannot differentiate between any of the current political parties.
Gordon, tell us who we should be voting for at the next Election, because I cannot differentiate between any of the current political parties.
Jacqui, far be it me from to TELL anyone who to vote for, it is an individual choice, and, a choice that once made, should bring with the successfully elected party, the expectation that said party carry out the promises made and laid out in their manifesto. Personally, and without ONE seconds thought, I shall be placing my mark in the box marked UKIP. In fact both Lorraine and I have just received our official Party Membership cards, and I shall support Mr. Farage , whom I have met, and his party, to the best of my ability.
I too, am exceptionally proud to have come from a family of Scottish Coal Miners, an N.C.B. surveyor myself, and voted Labour ALWAYS, until Blair , Brown, and the rest of that band of rogues totally buggered the Labour movement. So, Jacqui, and others , there you have my feelings. Make your own minds up, but be prepared to reap the whirlwind if Conmoron , Millibland, Cleggy, or, God forbid, Osborne become Chief Liar after the election.
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I shall be voting for the "Commas in Moderation Party" ........ ;)
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Gordon not sure how someone coming from a labour movement background can 'without a seconds' hesitation vote for a group of maverick right wingers, and indeed join what is a rag bag army of disaffected right wingers. I suppose their only saving grace is that they are not the Tories.. mind you most of them are disaffected and opportunist ex Tories.
Their leaders a right wing ex banker, and cannot for a moment be seen as a friend of either the wider labour movement or its aims and objectives, let alone the working class. They are bankrolled by one of the most reactionary Thatcherite billionaries, indeed one who is still proud to call himself a Thatcherite. So you'll forgive me for being more than a little confused by the company you'll be keeping in UKIP. Particularly as we've all seen your various posts on Thatcher and her policies.
Strange bedfellows indeed.
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Private Eye have been covering this story in 1979 why have the media only just decided this is news?
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UKIP are strange will I remain loyal to them in the future, I doubt it, but today they have my interest at heart, that being a Australia Border control system, and a promise for a vote to get us out of the debacle called EU.
After that I would expect them to be the useless MP's that all other parties have recently confirmed to being.
Now all you living in Turkey, like us when we lived in Turkey, what hoops do you have to jump through? what Turkish benefits are you getting? is you employment good in Turkey? are you enjoying you free health service? and proving that you had the funds to reside in Turkey hindered your residency? and do you like the way that the EU rule the Turkish judicial system?
(very much tongue in cheek)
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I've just noticed that Gordon's doing quotes properly now, or are you doing them for him Loz ? ;)
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[quote
[quote
[/quote][
I too, am exceptionally proud to have come from a family of Scottish Coal Miners, an N.C.B. surveyor myself, and voted Labour ALWAYS,
[/quote]
Is that why you live in the Affluent Conservative Constituency of Otterbourne Hampshire Gordon. ;) ;) ;)
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Ah, I see Gordon's passed on his knowledge of quotes to Des now.
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Quotes, well we had words, wwe also had words again regarding the difference between CBF and Facebook,
Des, the reason he now lives in the "Affluent" area of Otterbourne is because that is where I come from. ;)
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Private Eye have been covering this story in 1979 why have the media only just decided this is news?
It is because recently the Daily Mail used a Freedom of Information request to force access Cabinet Office documents that confirm this story.
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The Scottish perspective: UKIP... who are they?
JF
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Yes we don't have UKIP up here. However, I really cannot get my head around Christine and Neil Hamilton being local M.P.'s. Those two former conservatives have jumped on the UKIP bandwagon in the hope of getting Neil's face back in politics. I am sure the former owner of Harrods would vote for him ;D ;)
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Yes we don't have UKIP up here.
We did have a UKIP "presence, namely Christopher Monckton aka 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley. With a monniker like that he'd really go down a treat in places like Ferguslie Park, Torry or Niddrie!
Anyway, they all fell out up here and phucked off to Englandshire where it seems they can practise their right wing, xenophobic, homophobic, islamophobic policies to their wee hearts are content.
A charming quote from their original founder, Alan Sked, sums them up: "They're not an intellectually serious party. Their views on immigrants and on banning the burqa are morally dodgy."
Toodle pip!
JF
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Yes we don't have UKIP up here.
We did have a UKIP "presence, namely Christopher Monckton aka 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley. With a monniker like that he'd really go down a treat in places like Ferguslie Park, Torry or Niddrie!
Anyway, they all fell out up here and phucked off to Englandshire where it seems they can practise their right wing, xenophobic, homophobic, islamophobic policies to their wee hearts are content.
A charming quote from their original founder, Alan Sked, sums them up: "They're not an intellectually serious party. Their views on immigrants and on banning the burqa are morally dodgy."
Toodle pip!
JF
As long as Brits are languishing in foreign lands where they are not directly affected by the utter devastation of the U.K.'s National Health Service, amongst other agencies, by the sheer overwhelming amounts of immigrants, legal or otherwise, who are being allowed to settle in the U.K. we shall always get the distorted views of one or two misguided persons.
I find it really strange, and somewhat disconcerting, that other-wise seemingly intelligent people can show a degree of pure apathy toward the "well-being" of their own country !!
As for a lack of U.K.I.P. presence in my native Scotland, well , what can I say ? If Mr. Salmond had been allowed to drag Scotland, screaming and kicking, into " Independence ", the question would never have arisen re.
. U.K.I.P. or would it, as Salmond wanted " Independence " , but for the tax payers in England to pay for the resulting financial failings of his maniacal idea !
Anyway, this topic has , very cynically, been twisted to detract from my original attempt to discover just how many still think that THE BITCH is deserving of the accolades she received before and after her demise !!
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You must have been a cracking landlord Gordon with many a genteel bar room debate! ;D
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Gordon, I think it is really terribly sad that have allowed yourself to be led so easily off topic and up the garden path by artful members into derailing the thread through a personal declaration of love for UKIP. Perhaps you should pay more attention to Loz' classes on "How not to get yourself lost on the internet". However, since you have followed this up with yet another off-topic post on immigration I feel entitled to point out, in relation to the NHS, that without immigration the Health Service would have 40,000 fewer doctors and far, far fewer nurses. Indeed, without these immigrants the NHS would have collapsed in on itself years ago.
But I generally agree with your sentiments about Thatcher.
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As long as Brits are languishing in foreign lands where they are not directly affected by the utter devastation of the U.K.'s National Health Service, amongst other agencies, by the sheer overwhelming amounts of immigrants, legal or otherwise, who are being allowed to settle in the U.K. we shall always get the distorted views of one or two misguided persons.
I find it really strange, and somewhat disconcerting, that other-wise seemingly intelligent people can show a degree of pure apathy toward the "well-being" of their own country !!
Was my post you quoted factually incorrect in any way? In what way was it "distorted"?
As a country Scotland encourages immigration - had it gained independence it's likely the level of immigration would have risen, according to several political observers.
Generally speaking, Scotland has always been welcoming to immigrants and I know many Asians who are now second and third generation "Scots". Their word, not mine.
We've had Poles here for years, a great many settled after WW2 and their families and relatives followed.
Flourishing Chinese communities in Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee courtesy of HK.
Now we have Russians, Lithuanians, Belarusians, Bulgarians with the odd asylum seeker thrown in. Other than the asylum seekers, the majority of these folks are working - contributing to the economy and paying their taxes like any other Scottish individual.
Stealing jobs? Nah... they're often doing the sh1t jobs that local folks either don't want to do or they consider it beneath them.
JF
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Hows about this for an idea, have 50% of parliament to consist of women who are prone to PMS but have a bit of common sense, plus putting England before any other country and also with the belief that charity begins at home i.e: ENGLAND.
The kind I am thinking are of Maggie thatchers determination and stubbornness (political policies not included), so that when some prat in Brussels say we cannot kick someone out of UK because of human rights, she can (especially that time of the month) say, "Up yours sunshine, we live in this country, we make the decisions. End Of!!!"
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putting England before any other country and also with the belief that charity begins at home i.e: ENGLAND.
That should appeal to the electorate in Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. But, since that's more or less what happens now, I don't suppose anyone will notice the difference.
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Back on topic.
Yes, I think Maggie did a fine job in her day and I don't mind admtting that I worked for a company that in January 1986 was deeply involved in breaking the union's hold on Fleet Street.
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Gordon, I think it is really terribly sad that have allowed yourself to be led so easily off topic and up the garden path by artful members into derailing the thread through a personal declaration of love for UKIP. Perhaps you should pay more attention to Loz' classes on "How not to get yourself lost on the internet". However, since you have followed this up with yet another off-topic post on immigration I feel entitled to point out, in relation to the NHS, that without immigration the Health Service would have 40,000 fewer doctors and far, far fewer nurses. Indeed, without these immigrants the NHS would have collapsed in on itself years ago.
But I generally agree with your sentiments about Thatcher.
Colwyn, whilst I agree with your figures re. doctors & nurses , please read the following, I know you will , because you, like myself, are an " informationati " .
In 2012, 435,000 long-term international migrants arrived to live in England, which is 87% of the total 498,000 long-term immigrants to the UK. Scotland received 34,000 long-term immigrants (7% of total), 16,000 people (3% of total) immigrated to Wales and 12,000 people (2% of total) immigrated to Northern Ireland. England, Scotland and Wales had more long-term immigrants than long-term emigrants in 2012, with net migration figures of 158,000,14,000 and 8,000 respectively. By contrast, Northern Ireland had more long-term emigrants than long-term immigrants, resulting in a net outflow of 2,000.
So, yes, without immigrants, there may have been a short fall in the amount of medical staff in the N.H.S. but that beggars the question as to whether so many would have been necessary , but for the huge number of immigrants who are constantly putting more and more strain upon an already floundering service ??
Also, if Scotland is so welcoming to " long stay " immigrants, why is the total for the same year, 2012, a mere 7% of the total figure of 498,000 who turned up in the U.K. whilst England has been invaded by 87% of that total figure ??
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Hmmm..... Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics.
(http://goldenkeyscribes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/decison.jpg)
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You must have been a cracking landlord Gordon with many a genteel bar room debate! ;D
The following was, & still is my mantra, ;
Politics, or religion, should NEVER be discussed upon licensed premises !! ;-)
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And there was me thinking it was
Cheers for the beer!
All hail to the ale!
And a glass of white wine for the lady.
;)
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Might you be confusing Gordon with Al Murray?
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Hows about this for an idea, have 50% of parliament to consist of women who are prone to PMS but have a bit of common sense, plus putting England before any other country and also with the belief that charity begins at home i.e: ENGLAND.
The kind I am thinking are of Maggie thatchers determination and stubbornness (political policies not included), so that when some prat in Brussels say we cannot kick someone out of UK because of human rights, she can (especially that time of the month) say, "Up yours sunshine, we live in this country, we make the decisions. End Of!!!"
Sorry to piddle in your chips snow top, but methinks you are confusing yourself by mistaking the eu with the European court of human rights. And while we are on about thatcher and her policies, whose government was it that signed the UK up for Mastricht... You remember a deeper and wider Europe based on a single market ..... And with no referendum. Wasn't the witch herself was it?
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Back on topic.
Yes, I think Maggie did a fine job in her day and I don't mind admtting that I worked for a company that in January 1986 was deeply involved in breaking the union's hold on Fleet Street.
Yes and put it under the firm control of right wing foreign tax dodging individuals. Where shall we start with the Dirty Digger himself, the well known american / Australian, and we have seen what he and his place men and women are capable of, aside from criminal activities, there has also been there corruption of the UK political system. Then that good old Canadian jailbird and Thatcherite Conrad Black, what a charmer he was. And let's not forget members of the current crop, p0rn king Sullivan, and the Torygraph tax dodging and Tory sponsors..step forward the Berkley Bros, especially when they hold back stories on the activities of the criminal activities of hsbc, because of their investments. Let'S applaud them all.
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Anyway, Thatcher didn't cover up paedophilia at top political levels did she? 'Cos that would have been bad. And Thatcher lovers would have to confront it - and I applaud Lynne for doing exactly that, even though it was obviously painful. But I think she is the only one to have the honesty to do that.
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I suspect you might be Private Eye's stringer in Turkey UBT. ;)
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Yes and put it under the firm control of right wing foreign tax dodging individuals. Where shall we start with the Dirty Digger himself, the well known american / Australian, and we have seen what he and his place men and women are capable of, aside from criminal activities, there has also been there corruption of the UK political system. Then that good old Canadian jailbird and Thatcherite Conrad Black, what a charmer he was. And let's not forget members of the current crop, p0rn king Sullivan, and the Torygraph tax dodging and Tory sponsors..step forward the Berkley Bros, especially when they hold back stories on the activities of the criminal activities of hsbc, because of their investments. Let'S applaud them all.
Well, I s'pose we can't all be perfect eh ? ;)
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Looks like it was rife,
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/07/27/margaret-thatcher-sex-parties-paedophile-sir-peter-morrison-bodyguard_n_5624475.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/07/27/margaret-thatcher-sex-parties-paedophile-sir-peter-morrison-bodyguard_n_5624475.html)
no doubt many more toffs of all parties will eventually be named, What happened to the accused Tony Briton?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2816508/Are-vile-paedophile-allegations-against-Leon-Brittan-sinister-MI5-smear-plot-Labour-MP-uses-Commons-privilege-link-Tory-abuse.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2816508/Are-vile-paedophile-allegations-against-Leon-Brittan-sinister-MI5-smear-plot-Labour-MP-uses-Commons-privilege-link-Tory-abuse.html)
And then they all drop dead and get away with it.
http://conspiracytruths.co.uk/mpscovictedofsexoffense.html (http://conspiracytruths.co.uk/mpscovictedofsexoffense.html)
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Robert Maxwell's getting an easy ride tonight.
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Oh, deep joy, how happy it makes me to finally waken people up !!
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Robert Maxwell's getting an easy ride tonight.
Has he drugged his prey ??
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Salt water maybe?
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Cyril Smith was a Liberal as I recall and not a Conservative. Once it all comes out in the wash, I think we may see many people from different political parties implicated.
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Cyril Smith was a Liberal as I recall and not a Conservative. Once it all comes out in the wash, I think we may see many people from different political parties implicated.
Thatcher refused to act upon any of the allegations levelled at the obnoxious pervert, and she was in a position to do so, but turned her back on any investigation, therefore turning her back on the many young boys who were raped by him , no matter which political party he represented. At best, like Saville, all he was interested in was how he could facilitate access to vulnerable children, and those who knew, or even suspected, and SHOULD have intervened,..... DID NOT !!
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"she turned her back on any investigation" >:( . Hmmmmm but then again they say she was a bit of a Dominatrix.. 8) possibly birds of a fe----r :o .
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Cyril Smith was a Liberal as I recall and not a Conservative. Once it all comes out in the wash, I think we may see many people from different political parties implicated.
Thatcher refused to act upon any of the allegations levelled at the obnoxious pervert, and she was in a position to do so, but turned her back on any investigation, therefore turning her back on the many young boys who were raped by him , no matter which political party he represented. At best, like Saville, all he was interested in was how he could facilitate access to vulnerable children, and those who knew, or even suspected, and SHOULD have intervened,..... DID NOT !!
Yes we know all that about Smith, my point was it was not just the conservatives she was sheltering, who knows how many and from what parties she had kept quiet about ?
It seems she did not want a Parliamentary scandal from any side of the political spectrum.
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I think it's quite clear from what has been uncovered that no matter which party they are supposed to represent, they all "wee IN THE SAME POT"
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Thanks Gorden you have woken me up.
But I don't think UKIP are the answer.
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Thanks Gorden you have woken me up.
But I don't think UKIP are the answer.
I do though, and that is where I shall be putting my vote. There IS no simple answer, but Coalition government does not , and CANNOT work. Clegg had not a hope in hell of getting any of his parties policies through against Cameron, who just bulldozes his ideas through, so where is/was the coalescence within the present government?
One thing about this , that really does make me so angry, and disillusioned, with the electorate of this country is, that for decades, many people were of the opinion that we needed a new political party, with new ideas, and a new vision, and now that there is just such a party in U.K.I.P. , those same persons are still looking toward Conservative, who are only interested in making their ilk richer, Liberal, who are totally inept, Labour, well, I'm lost for words on that lot , Green Party leadership struggle to string words together in order to form a sentence !!!! Who is left ??
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GordonA - I am genuinely surprised that you have "pledged" your vote to any political party before they have published their manifesto.
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Off topic I realise but do you fancy a crack at that Top Gear job Gordon now old Gemmers is on a yellow card? ;D
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GordonA - I am genuinely surprised that you have "pledged" your vote to any political party before they have published their manifesto.
" H " , I am happier doing that than listening to a party of lying b*****ds who make so many totally empty promises, in the lead up to EVERY single General Election in my lifetime, only to renege on almost all of them, except those which make more money and better lives for his own type of people !!
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Off topic I realise but do you fancy a crack at that Top Gear job Gordon now old Gemmers is on a yellow card? ;D
Gladly, I certainly have the arrogance, terrific stage presence, am a lot better looking, ( mind you, a cow has just gone past with better looks than Clarkson ) !! I am probably just as, if not more, intelligent, I find it REALLY easy to wee people off, and apart from my very good friend, The Laird Scunner of Perthchestershire, the best wind up merchant in Christendom !! ( I sometimes do wish that people would realise that most of the time, that is exactly what I am doing ) !!!!
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your doing a good job of it to GORDON :'( ;D : :)
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part from my very good friend, The Laird Scunner of Perthchestershire, the best wind up merchant in Christendom !! ( I sometimes do wish that people would realise that most of the time, that is exactly what I am doing ) !!!!
Awwwwwww NOOOOOO! I thought you were bloody serious, like me !!!!
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part from my very good friend, The Laird Scunner of Perthchestershire, the best wind up merchant in Christendom !! ( I sometimes do wish that people would realise that most of the time, that is exactly what I am doing ) !!!!
Awwwwwww NOOOOOO! I thought you were bloody serious, like me !!!!
Oh believe me, you are both in the same toy box.
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Yeah but my trainset's better than his !
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Maybe your party Gordon should be the ranting , raving , loony party
Wind up
Honest
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I still say 50% of the government should be PMS women to balance out the gutless men we have in power.
The only labour I would vote for is the pregnant women!!!
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Snowtop - you clearly have no understanding of the male menopause ;).
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Snowtop - you clearly have no understanding of the male menopause ;).
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh, I really DO despair sometimes . Tell you what, let's all just keep on like this, and " enjoy " another parliament where the only people getting what they really want are the mega rich bigots !!
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Maybe your party Gordon should be the ranting , raving , loony party
Wind up
Honest
I could care less, even MORE honest !