Brown is an Idiot, Vote for New Ideas

[Scunner]

That would mean the Conservative Party lost. Yes, that does seem like a good system.

[Colwyn]

quote:Great system eh:(

Naturally, if the Tories get in they won't change the system. They'll just close the BBC website - their rich media chums don't like the competition.

p.s. I just noticed that Scunner no longer looks like an advert for a cleaning product. Must be time for change.

[nichola]

H - I have seen you post a couple of times, relatively recently that we don't have many debates on the forum these days. I'm relatively new to the Forum and one thing I do miss about the UK is the opportunity now and then to have a good discussion and debate.

This seems the perfect topic for a good debate but if we all agree or are too afraid to say what we think then it wouldn't be much fun or much of a debate.

I can admit when I am wrong and I am always interested in what others have to say - I don't have to agree but I also know I don't know everything. I know that my opinions on lots of issues have changed and developed over the years!

When I entered this debate I listed a number of things - all true about the previous Tory Governments. The outcomes of their policies are there for all to see. The Labour of today is not the Labour of the 70's and for all its faults it has a fairly good record of achievements over the past 13 years (the Iraq war being the most notable exception). I have posted a couple of links below for those interested.

As far as I am concerned most people are basically kind and caring and this can be seen in the everyday actions of many who go out of their way to help others.

Yet it makes me sad that so many people also often seem full of hate towards groups of people who at the end of the day are just people with feelings and hopes and dreams like you and me. I can't live my life resenting what others have more than me and I try to live my life according to my principles.

Anyway enough said...  

http://www.labouronline.org/wibs/165781/labour_achievements?PageId=f1c17867-df51-64b4-49a9-c01cf3b04cf6

http://www.labour.org.uk/policies/labours-achievements

[Highlander]

quote:Originally posted by nichola

H - I have seen you post a couple of times, relatively recently that we don't have many debates on the forum these days.

That's because I'm an argumentative S.O.B Nichola .

I was interested in your two links and I have to say that I would doubt some of the statements made eg

Record levels of literacy and numeracy in schools and
Best-ever primary school results.

I also believe that you can prove anything with figures which is why I would have thought the claim as to the number of extra nurses would have been the same in both links

[barry44544]

No one can refute that the Tories closed more hospitals in the 19 years they were in government and waiting list
for operations were about 18 months long.
The health service had to change. So many hospitals have been built or improved.
There is just no comparison.
All The Tories are offering with their "new team" is all the same faces they had 19 years ago.
THey sacked more leaders in the last 25 years than any other party.
They were more corrupt.
In 19 years there was more attacks on British soil than in the last 13.
I may not have decided who to vote for....
But I know it wont be the Tories.

[Highlander]

quote:Originally posted by barry44544

The health service had to change.
In 19 years there was more attacks on British soil than in the last 13.

Barry on the Health  Service, as I said you can prove anything with figures

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8587122.stm


On attacks on British soil - can you explain further, please.

[nichola]

Maybe the dates when these were written are different and one is done by a constituency Labour Party it seemed to me and one by the LP HQ. I guess the point is there are more nurses   and Matrons were brought back onto wards.

I don't thimk people can dispute that waiting times are down from a year or more to a few weeks.

I thought for anyone interested there were some extra bits of info and more explanation to be gained by reading both.

I also thought that a lot of these points were tangible things that can make a big difference to someones life at the point it affects them.

2 weeks paternity leave - minimum wage - right to 4 weeks paid holiday - free nursery places for 3 and 4 year olds - small things that make a big difference to peoples quality of life  

Scotland has done particularly well with its devolved government has it not?

[Highlander]

quote:Originally posted by nichola

Scotland has done particularly well with its devolved government has it not?

Is that leaving aside the fact that it is a monstrosity and that it cost £ 450 million. How many hospitals would that have built.

On the election itself, one of the biggest disappointments to me has been the way Brown and Cameron have dismissed the idea of a balanced parliament. I would have far preferred had they both said, ok, a sizeable percentage of the voters haven't voted for us, lets see if we can work with the people they have voted for for the good of the country.

[nichola]

I'm all in favour of consensue govt but no party ever admits to being prepared to work with another b4 the election as they want to be seen as strong.

It seems fairly obvious that Labour and Lib Dems have more in common with each other and I think many Liberal voters would be well hacked off if they did a deal with Cameron.

My concern over a hung parliament is the effect on the £ which will surely plummet and that will screw us all...

[Highlander]

quote:Originally posted by Colwyn

p.s. I just noticed that Scunner no longer looks like an advert for a cleaning product. Must be time for change.

You never know Colwyn, I may even have my own avatar restored.